New Adventure of Naga& Zulu (crocs)

[firepowerfox03]

Well to Steeve and anyone one else that wants to read this. Zulu and Naga had a car ride today and it was amazing on how well behaved they were. Since this was my friends Cavalier as my Fiero was out of the question. With blankets on place both crocs place in the back seat off we went. Zulu went immediately up by the back window and laid there like those dogs things withe the bobbing heads that you see in your grandparents car. Naga promptly put both feet up by the window (all windows were closed) and stared out at passing traffic etc. Vroom out we went to the country to get ahotdog and fried and then down the locks to watch the boats. As we pulled into the hotdog stand Gary was brave and stayed in the car to watch them and I went off to get some low cal double burgers and shakes. People walking by did a double take not sure if what they were seeing was real or not. At one point they were both up there curled up in the sun. I brought bottled water and a water spritzer to give them a refreshing in car shower. To make a long story short for 3 hours they were as good as gold as we drove around and Naga wanted french fries but got a mouse instead. She said "What no gravy?" Anyhoo what fun it was to have them in the car with us and them looking out the window at the passing countryside wondering "Okay this seems cool" Think I can get them to bring me a leash for walkies now? LOL Steeve you are right they are both so special. Zulu will drink water out of a bowl as I hold it for him and yes I got a whole bunch of pics with my old camera not my diggy one. I am dying to see them. Naga looking out the car window like a small dog was such a hoot. We both laughed the whole time in the car as it was soooo funny.:p

[Steeve B]

bla bla

[firepowerfox03]

I did not want to believe Matt about these lists but sadly enough it is true Goodbye to all. Steeve they were both fine and even slept abit. In my humble opinion they were very relaxed and ate the mice I gave them. Thanks for your info to date

[Steeve B]

bla bla

[firepowerfox03]

Matt said these lists were just not worth joining as people get jumped on all the time by others. Yes maybe I use unconventional methods with my exotics (btw people I live with a caracal who is harness trained, minks foxes indo squirrels and other monitors. but it is only by socialization that gets them used to me and if and when they must go to the vet or being examined it is not an alien experience they are not stressed to the point of freaking out, The male croc now after a few days when I go into his pen or the pen outdoors very rarely huffs at me and lets me treat his tail. BYW I think a 3 hour car ride in an air conditioned car is nothing compared to being packed up and sent overseas (Japan) to god knows what . Let see now an overseas flight that has to be a few hours. Zulu was on a 2 hour flight and chewed his own damn tail. Am I pissed off now damn right I am. If I must take Zulu to the vet he is gonna have to go in a car and at least now he knows what it is about, You can imagine taking a sick croc to the vet that has never hardly been handled or been in a car and is sick to boot. WOULD i GIVE HIM A KISS OR LET HIM SLEEP IN MY BED. NO DO YOU THINK I AM THAT STUPID? It is only by handling him and spending time with him will I know what he will and not let me do. Okay so there and thats the name of that tune.

[Steeve B]

bla bla

[Scales Zoo]

Penny, I am sure you will get an earful from plenty of people.

My only concern is them loose in the car, because in the event of a crash, it could be a disaster. And it is the stuff that broadsides you on an idle afternoon you really need to worry about.

Enjoy those monitors every way you can!

Sheila

[asphyxia]

If you think Steve was Harsh with you you havent seen anything yet, lol. Stay tuned.


Brian

[Steeve B]

bla

[Linds]

Steeve said everything I would have, so I won't go over what he said. However, I do have one thing to add. Loose monitors in a car, no matter how well acclimated they are to it all, is just a disaster waiting to happen. These animals, no matter how long they have gone without incident, or how acclimated they are to everything, are still wild. What would happen should one of them launch in to the front seat? Or give a bite? So many things could happen that could cause a possibly fatal car crash... and not just you, there could be many other vehicles involved. Or even if someone else caused an accident, they could escape and wreak havoc. There are enough "accidents" out there that are causing bans on reptiles all over. Please keep this in mind.

I'm sorry you feel that joining the site was a mistake. People that jump down others throats are few and far between, and if it does happen, there is often a reason. If people are seeming to jump down your throat, it is because we are deeply concerned for the situation - both you and your animals, and the possible effects it could have on all of us as a community. This site is number one for a reason, we have a huge sense of community and do not tolerate any bashing, slander, personal attacks, or otherwise uncalled for behaviour. Don't get all upset, just try and see where we are coming from :)

Take care.

[V.hb]

anyone would jump on you for doing something that crazy!! Understand these are large aggressive predatory animals!

you put yourself in danger, you put the animals in danger, you put others on the road in danger....

[markb]

Hello Firepower,

I read your posttwice to make sure I was reading it correctly. The last perso who did this, nearly died in a car accident, in Europe, when he picked up his wild-caught V. salvadorii from the airport and was driving the 75 Km to his home, when he looked in the rear-view mirrow and saw this 8 foot V. salvadorii staring right back at him! He drove off the road and nearly crashed his car to pieces - and that lizard was merely looking at him.

I fully agree with Steve b., Linds, Vh.b on this - it was irresponsible to yourself, your passenger, the lizards, other drivers on the road. Not a smart thing to do, and you were very lucky the lizards did not decide to take a chunk out of your neck, or your passengers, while feeding them, while driving, while eating....it is this kind of behavior that gets in the press, give herpers a bad name/reputation, is illegal to transport a dangerous animal without proper restraint etc...Please reconsider next time you want to do something like this.

You can get large pvc pipe, long enough to put the lizards into, build a wire door and transport them in that if you like? Furthermore, do lizards get car sick? Mouse vomit is repulsive but all varanophiles know about - and in your friends car!

I think You were Lucky this time...maybe not next time!
good luck,
mark bayless

[NewLineReptile]

100% agree with everyone that has replyed.
Not good thinking man

Brandon

[firepowerfox03]

okay all this is absolutely my last post here and then I am outta here. First of I made my story sound funny as this list is in some dire need of humour. If i want deadpan lists I will join a morticians chat forum. First of all we did a trial run around the block to see how they would react. I watched them at all times and they were calm to the point of even closing their eyes. I do not need approval from anyone here I just wanted to share something that was out of the norm. You know when Diane Fossey and Jane Goodall studied the mountain gorillas and chimps they were very unconventional and gave their study charges names and recorded their personalities, They had physical contact with them also which was extremely frowned upon by the so called learned scientific community. Louise Leakey specifically picked them as they had no formal training. Jane Goodall was a waitress at one time and Diane Fossey was a therapist who worked with mentally challenged children and had 1 year vet training. Louise Leakey wanted someone out ther in the field they had no preconcieved notions of what the animals should be doing according to paper studies. Diane Fossey and Jane Goodall ebentually did get thier doctorates so they could present their thesis to the scientific community. Has anyone here ever seen that pic of a gorilla making contact with Diane Fossey and touchin her hand. That came about from her methods. They knew something whcih it seems a lot of people here do not. All species share certain traits but they are also individuals. I had a blue tail that was so tame she'd wear a harnes and hang around my neck and I took her everywhere with me. My other one would rather bite me then look at me. Look anyone can post a website and claim to be an expert. From what I see there is so much conflicting info on any monitor is is hard to know what is right. You were not there with me in the car with them and have no friggin idea how they reacted okay? If after just a few days I can go up to the male and he lets me clean his tail and then I sit in the pen with them as they eat and then sun them selves. I take a sprinkler outside and mist them and Zulu closes his eyes and stretches his neck towards the water. I do not have to be an expert to see he is starting to trust me as caregiver and foodbringer. ASK STEEVE IT IS IS SAFE TO LET HIS CHILDREN RIDE HIS 100 POUND NILE MONITOR AS IF IT WAS A PONY. THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT HE TOLD ME OVER THE PHONE. NOW I ASK YOU IS THIS SAFE? At least I had the guts to tell you guys about something that was amazing and unique. Shame on you you cowards. REMEMBER WHAT GEORGE SCHALLER ONCE SAID "A LOVING PET OWNER WILL TELL YOU MORE ABOUT ANIMAL BEHAVIOR THEN MOST LABORATORY BEHAVIORISTS" From what I have seen so far these monitors have the intelligence and now trust in me to be more then a zoo speciaman. I plan to learn as much as I can about them. Learning and knowledge will come from them trusting me and me watching and learning from them. OKAY here ya go have a filed day folks. I won't be back. I will share my info in the future with others.

[NewLineReptile]

You need your head checked most of your last post had nothing to do with what you did. As for you saying steeve let's his kid's ride his 100lb Nile. That i can't say is true or not. But if it is that is almost as stupid as what you did

Brandon

[V.hb]

Nobody is bashing you or becoming negative but if you really can't understand the dangers you put yourself, and others into you don't deserve to own those animals. I cant believe you posted that you did this!!! those animals arent cheap, you invested in your first varanid iam guessing and purchased a pair of crocs?!!? jeez.

[lordkovacs]

I do not own a monitor, and never will...but does it not make sense even to put the monitor at least into one of those dog or large cat travelling cages? I mean, they are pretty big...big enough for a monitor. I could be wrong...if I am just disregard...but they are very open, yet secure. and at the same time, it's more safe, and they get used to going to the vet's, or wherever. just an idea...
cheers,
MIKE

[lordkovacs]

oh, another thing, people were talking about the impact it would have on other people driving their cars. monitor bites you, you swerve and endanger EVERY other driver. Hell, if someone is gonna f'n drive drunk I would care more about the other people on the road before I worry about that person. same thing. you endanger everyone else by doing that. ALL REPTILES have instincts despite how long they have been in captivity... if that weren't true, why do you need to lock them up? why not put your head in their mouths? You don't cause they still have their instincts and they can do damage. just a thought..
MIKE

[markb]

Hi Firepower,

I have corresponded with George Schaller, on Orcas, and had lunch with Jane Goodall and other primatologists here in Berkeley. Boy oh boy can I tell you stories about Louis Leakey, Diane Fossey and others! Anyway, they are very noble people and took chances - risky, sometimes life-threatening chances in the name of Science - the persons posting are saying the same thing - LOOK OUT! BE CAREFUL! Thats all....if you cannot take this comments, that is a shame. I believe you wanted to inject some levity here, thats great! and I appreciate humor more than most!
But things like can go disasterously wrong, and nobody wants to see that happen to you...think about it.

V. salvadorii is a wild animal that does what it needs to do, on its terms - you have not interjected anything so far, to change its behavior, but someday, unprovoked, you might!! Keep this in the back on your mind ok?

good luck,
markb

[Steeve B]

bla

[Zoe]

I am not a varanid owner, and know little about them beyond some research I did a while back when contemplating getting one... but I would not BELIEVE that post when I read it. I thought it was a joke or that I did understand correctly. Reptiles aren't dogs, they don't have "fun" driving around the city looking at stuff. They are afraid in that situation! And just because they were closing their eyes, it doesn not mean they were calm. My lizard closes her eyes when she is afraid.
And I do believe the concern was also for other people. Yes you had your eye on them, but whats stopping one of them from getting irritated and attacking... where'll you be then?

Chimps and crocs ARENT the same thing. Not even close. I don't see how comparing yourself to Jane Goodall, makes what you did right.

Now, no one jumped on you at all... they were simply apalled by the behaviour exibited. I think almost anyone would be! They are concerned for you and the crocs - what is wrong with that? Would you rather hear "good, keep stressing your crocs around in your car, maybe throw them on some children next time you are out in the city with wild varanids!"? If so, then it is probably better you have chosen to leave, because there is no sense in giving advice that will not be taken.

However, if you are willing to listen to what is being said, and consider it from both sides - as well as admitting that what you did was not the wisest thing as opposed to get offended when you're countered then you will be an asset to this site.

Sorry to hear you want to leave - I am even sorrier for your crocs and anyone they may end up injuring (or worse).

:( Zoe

Steeve - you are probably right.

[Steeve B]

bla bla

[V.hb]

Steeve, as irresonsible as some people can be, its not nessecarily fair to take the enjoyment (varanids) out of the hobby for yourself, and others that you wish to aid with their varanids. I assure you not everyone is as far out as "firepower". I for one have used pretty well everything you have advised me to, and its working great. My monitors are doing much better with all of the info you provided me with. If you decide not to work with varanids anymore, it's truely a shame. You are living proof that varanids can be kept, bred and remain healthy and natural in an unnatural captive setting.. I really hope you choose to continue to enjoy this hobby!

[asphyxia]

^^ exactly what he said ^^


Best Regards
Brian

[ectotherm]

Did I ever tell you guys how much my spitting cobras like to have their chins tickled?

*Flat out couldn't resist*

Without heaping any more insult upon our croc owner/motorist, I only want to illuminate the larger picture:

It is that kind of example of behavior in handling dangerous exotics that will be referred to as cause for banning the ownership of such animals. There are a hundred ways that the "adventure" could have gone wrong. Sadly, you weren't aware of any of them. That scares me. Best of luck with the pair. Please obtain some standard animal crates if and when travelling by car becomes necessary in the future.

[Siretsap]

Lol ectotherm, I want a pic of that!!! :-p
Na don't wouln't even want to imagine what could have happened if you were to try and tickle a cobra's chin.
As for the person who drove her crocs in a car, well were those the 2 crocs someone wants to give away on this forum if they can prove they can care for them?
Anyhow, I had a back roughneck (baby about 2 or 3 months old) and it was a wc and had a lot of ulceres in it's insides. I treated him with baytril injections I had to give him each day. And I still took precautions even if I was 99% certain he would never bite me because of the 1% chance he would. She should have done the same thing and think about that % that could have made the cros react and bite or whip.

[Steeve B]

bla bla

[Siretsap]

I wasn't comparing it to them, just saying that if I take precautions for a rn (which is smaller and less tempered) then she should really take more precautions.
I saw a salvadori croc in a petstore near me, the people there aren't being careful of it, the cage is right at the entrance and people always stick their fingers in the cage...

[reverendsterlin]

wow, as guess there is no helping when a site gets as large as this one but having some folks that just plain don't need to be in the hobby. I guess this is a perfect place to say be VERY carefull who you listen to here. Lately seems like I have seen too many people posting advise or making statements that are incorrect, totally wrong for the species, or just bad. Be sure to make your own judgements about who you'll listen to or believe, some of the things said here can lead to the death or poor health of your animal or put you or your family in danger. lol I own 2 gaboon vipers that have never struck at or bitten anyone so they must be safe to play with using the logic that started this thread. I feel her leaving was a plus for the forums. There is unconventional and there is stupid, a large loose croc in a vehicle falls under the second.

[Steeve B]

I re edited my post on this thread as I felt I was talking to a wall, bla bla is just about what a wall who’d understand.

Apparently queen of the jungle is offering the male for sell, as it turns out his not so tame any more!

All my recent posting about crocs before and after she came here was to make here see and understand these are not pets.

Somebody pleas hold me!!! Before I… Damn
(Steve banging head on wall sins last week)

Ps. I want to make this clear, my understanding with the first owner (before he sold to Penny) was he sell them back to me shod he sell them. Not respected

He took them outside neighbours made complaint leaving him no option but to sell,
Again Damn…

[chuck911jeep]

this man shouldn't be always a varanophil.... With an attitude like that, the "real responsable owner" will be penalised one day....

[MattQuinn]

I'm the first owner of the crocs. That is not why I sold them at all, in fact, that did not even happen(me taking them outside or neighbor complaints or whatever). The reason I "sold" them was because I was making space for retics, and steve refused to negotiate with trades for retics, so I sold them elsewhere. Penny(the idiot who took them for car ride) did not pay for these crocs, and I am still owed the balance.

[mbayless]

Has penny been found dead with large gaping bloody wounds on her person yet? With the croc monitors running around the inside of an automobile??

I hope you get your $$ and isn't it horrible to find out what people do to such wonderful animals, unbeknownst to themselves....

good luck,
markb

[MattQuinn]

Penny is nowhere to be found. There is nothing I regret more than releasing these animals into such careless hands.
Best regards Mark hope things are well with you.
-MQ

[Steeve B]

Dear Matt Quinn,

First let me say this hole story is one hard lesson to deal with for me, it was my babies you carelessly sent to the butcher, aim desperately trying to take all the blame on me for having sold these to you, as I see it you where not ready to make the commitment these monitors needed, however retic’s need the same kind of devotion, therefore you’ve gotten me between a rock and a hard place, my croc babies VS my Retic babies!

I really wanted to take this to court, hopping it who’d give you a lesson!
However the lesson was on me, it made me realize just how emotionally involve I am with my animals, now aim more selective of future keepers.

Also I will never again offer this species! And aim grateful you haven’t breed them.
All in all except for my pair of croc,s and Penny’s sever bite, this was a good lesson.
This ordeal has made me realize the need for strict regulation concerning potentially dangerous reptiles, therefore I will work with authorities concerned to regulate there keeping.

None respected agreement ( $300ea was the price not $6000 albino retic)
Hiding city regulation (you are not allowed to keep giant reptiles)
These are my legal points
I suggest you take legal advising before you make a dumb move, its not like your in Arizona where the Canadian justice cant get you.

Rgds
Steeve blain

Ps. Pleas refrain from contacting me in anyway

[Retic chic]

I have contact info for Penny, as we still speak often. Even though we do not always agree, we still maintain a friendship. She is doing well with the female, so I have heard. Anyone loking to contact her may PM me here.

Sheila

[MattQuinn]

First of all, I don't try to contact you, I leave that for the gullible asskissers on this forum.

As for retic, you kept offering me 1.1 Sul babies- I had 1.4 LARGE adult Suls to deal with. And you are the one that offered an albino, I did not ask for one.

AND, I do have a license to keep/propagate specially protected and game reptiles and amphibians in captivity- I have this license for the reticulated python.

So it's wrong that I sold animals >that I payed for< to someone because we were on bad terms at the time of their release?

Do not make assumptions about me, or publicly defemate my character, or question my husbandry skills, or I will do the same to you.

-Matt Quinn

[Steeve B]

assumtions? I kept the emails
the point is you didnt respect an agrement, to sell them back to me for the same price, you said youd take care of them as long as they live, then one day you call me all exited saying your niebores saw them and are goin to make a complaint, and this is terrible as your city regulation prohibit you from keeping these animals (do you think I whod have sold you them knowing this?)
you said youd rather keep retics (you hade 0 nada) at this time, now your saying you hade 1.4 adults, I offered you some babies but you whanted to scam me YES SCAM me by optaining big $$ in echange for some animals I basicly gave you $300ea, you my friend are dishonest and make me sick.
check your mail box, as I realy have no resons to make you any favors, I was clear get legal advising on my last post

[MattQuinn]

Actually, yes I did have 1.4 large adult Sulawesis at that time. I don't want to go over this **** with you here, or anywhere.
You are a story teller, and it really confuses me when I think of possible motives for what arouses your corrupt mindset, so let's drop this issue. I was always a friend to you and would back you and your strange lieing character.

SCAM?! how many freakin scams have you pulled on me with false promises, bogus trips we were supposed to go on
or what happened to "matt, its good to see whos my friend...come visit me and see these crocs hatch, I'll give you 1.1 sorong locale" strangely the time came for me to drive up to see them hatch and that didn't happen. You never had any crocs hatch, ever.
you say you don't keep records of breeding, you just check your incubator daily. So How do you know when the eggs are going to hatch over month before hand like you used to tell me? that doesn't add up.
you say the only reason you don't provide evidence of you hatching your monitors is because the people of the forum don't deserve it-then why do you show pics of copulation?
it's obvious to most of us that you don't breed monitors Steeve, so keep up what youre doing here and eventually the rest will see.

YOU ARE THE BIGGEST SCAM IN CANADA and you still have the people of this forum eating out of your hand. This is your last safe haven and you will ruin this too- all in time when they find out you don't breed monitors and are not a man of your word.
Stop emailing me with legal threats.
Legal action against me? hah! do your worst.

[Steeve B]

thanks now I can ad slandering too, keep digging yourself

[MattQuinn]

Since I still have the shovel in my hand...
All the times you invited the "doubters" to go see your breeding efforts and you never let any of that happen, except for a certain Ontario resident who's name starts with an R, I don't recall any evidence seen by him, does anyone else remember verificaion of viable eggs or CB hatchlings by him?

Or the time you had 17 macraei eggs incubating and I was to Pay top dollar for 5 individuals, drive to montreal and select them personally. That never happened, in fact for when they were supposed to hatch, you did not contact anyone for a month because your computer was broken right? Ok sure!

With you Steeve Blain-if that is your real name, the list of lies goes on and on. And recalling that you publicly admitted to lieing about breeding monitors on KS last year, it makes me wonder who is really digging himself a hole.

[Steeve B]

Aim not a dealer nor a public facility, I have no obligations to sell give or trade any animals or to have peoples nosing in my collection.

what your saying makes no sense to me whatsoever, you like many others are victims of a snow ball effect, generous slandering on my behalf from the king of monitor breeding ( he is the only monitor breeder I ever invited) nothing that was ever said against me was based on solid facts,
all of you are asking way too much from me, I never claimed anything, however many said I did, all my post are aimed at being informative and helpful nothing more, you have no right to ask more.
I was called every name in the book, and accused of just about anything, it was also said that I don’t keep monitors and that all I needed to do was walk in a pet shop and buy one, it was said that none of my species where in this country, it was said that no lace monitor where in my possession, it was said that I never produced anything, it was said that I wasn’t the father of my kid's so much have been said on such ridiculous things.
it makes me wonder how safe these forums are?
regardless of what you say, you and I have a personal beef
I wont accept any apologies from you
I will make a very real example of how forum nonsense can affect real peoples in real life, so pleas add all you wish to the already elaborate piece of crap you posted, trust me it wont make it any worst for you, I do not care about my reputation on these forums, if I did I who’d have folded long ago!

however aim very tired of all the little peoples taking cheep shots at me for in my opinion nothing of importance.
see you in court body
then you can come back and tell peoples if aim a man of my word
your right this was my last heaven, a place where none of the little peoples came and said stupid things about me, guess its time for me to move on to something more fulfilling.

[chuck911jeep]

give food pig and he will come **** on your porch! I think this is how you call that....

[V.hb]

Matt, steve is anything but a scammer.. i've dealt with him with no problems.... Hes been incredibly helpful with me.. Maybe you need to work on your attitude to get a step further..

[MattQuinn]

The only reason I am attacking him now is if you read this page 3 of posts, I clearly asked him not to attack me publicly or I will do the same, Now here we are- it was his choice, not mine.
I was defending false statements made by Steeve about me.

I don't see a meaning to your post at all, but I'm sure many more of his current asskissers will have alot to say about this deal that had nothing do with them.
Happy herping!

[Steeve B]

what false statements? that you lied to me and you didn’t respect our agreement?
who are you to come here and insult peoples you don’t know.
first you haven’t contributed anything on this site, now you come here and say all kinds of stuff that has nothing to do with the statements I have made, and you dare to tell others it has nothing to do with them, aim sorry but it dos, your irresponsible action reflects on every herpers on this site, its guys like you who will sell anything to whom will pay without any consideration for the beings involved that must be sifted out amongst the good keepers. you played me real good into trusting you, now I know better and will never make this kind of mistake again, you flat lied to me trying to manipulate me into giving you what you wanted for the crocs, but I saw clearly into your little game and stop playing. now aim not saying stupid things about you, aim sticking to the facts, I suggest you do the same cause where we are going the big man don’t care about yes but he said! this and that.

aim telling you like it is, you cant make a deal with me and not respect it, and come here laugh in my face
I can understand your young and have no experience, this is why I will go out of my way to show you, then perhaps when you deal with others you will respect your agreements. you keep posting like an idiot, this even if I advised you to get advising, in this country a verbal agreement is just as good as a contract, you shod stop acting like nothing is happening and start thinking defensively.
This will hurt I can tell
cant blame me for not letting you know

[MattQuinn]

As I said, my only business to post here on these forums was to defend something that never happened. I'm not going to repost the same things over and over as clearly you have your own very different concept of what is occurring and has occurred, one that I do not comprehend and will no longer try to debate with.
The people of this forum are more affected by your crap which should be classified as theory rather than fact. Fact needs proof, not faith.
You talk this and that about your love for the animals you "produce", but still you have skinning stations at your facility?
As hostile as my posts seem, I do not want to be here defending myself, but you leave me no choice.

[Steeve B]

Aim sorry Matt but you always have a choice! we all have a choice, sure we may not all agree That’s why there’s a justice system. its a human thing one thinks he’s right and the other think he’s right also, I have nothing against this, just as long as one doesn’t try to sink the other in mud, in my book nobody deserve to be treated this way, I understand your vary upset with this thread, much of it I have deleted therefore you cant really know what have been said, sure I was agree with you when writing on this thread, however those who remember it will tell you I have never said anything bad about you, other then expressing how upsetting your selling them was to me, if your last few highly expressive post where because you tot I bad mouthed you on this thread, rest assure I did not.
now pleas stop this thing about theory and proof and whatever else you may want or others may from me, read my post for what they are nothing more. really I don’t care about what I never said, however all I said was well intended.
to me its quit clear, you obviously regret your deal with Penny, and perhaps given an other chance you’d do things differently, trust me many of us who’d.
get some sleep young Jedi

[MattQuinn]

Yes, I would have done things very differently. And I do believe that it was morally wrong for me not to get them back to you. You won't accept apology but I'm sorry for not doing so. That was not what I was commenting on, but the issue was aroused and it turned into bashing time from both ends.
You must understand I have nothing against anyone here, but when I become openly attacked I will defend myself, and to me there is nothing more frustrating than an online fued. So I am ready to stop the online bashing, because this is going nowhere but a broken keyboard and a headache.
Kind Regards to all,
Matt Quinn

[Steeve B]

Learning to forgive a much grater accomplishment then any breeding
I too hate fights but sometime they make you grow
You have grown in my eyes
Regards

[MattQuinn]

Thank you for the kind words. I truly wish you well Steeve.
Sincerely,
Matt Quinn