Melamine Construction Question

[Invictus]

I posted this question in another thread, but I was unable to delete it, but I figure this may warrant a separate discussion.

I want to construct some enclosures out of melamine, because it's so easy to clean, and basically water-tight.

However, I've been told by a lot of people that Melamine will not hold a screw with any degree of stability, and that the only way to build out of melamine is to use glue/dowell methods. I want to know if anyone here has ever had problems with using screws in melamine, specifically when you screw into the side of it (the thin particle side).

If not, what types of screws should I use, and how durable is melamine, really?

[nuno]

Use particle board screws not wood screws they grab much nicer.

[Mason]

I have no idea what you are talking about, but it sounds like you are talking about some sort of plastice. My advice to you is to go with the glue, get some aquarium glue from say "Pet Value". Don't use screws, unless you really (think) know what you are doing.

[Grant vg]

Only enclosures i have ever built are melamine, i think ive built around 12 or so, some 4 foots, some 6 foots. never had a problem using particle board screws as mentioned above by nuno.
Pre drill everything, and make sure you dont power drill the screws into the wood too much, as thats when you can easily split the wood. i usually leave every screw out a few millimeters until im fully done with the cage.
then i completely screw everything in except the bottoms., as i find by leaving a few millimeters out on the bottoms aids in stacking enclosures and leaving room to slip heat tape/heat pads underneath without having to router...

Goodluck with em'!

Gvg

[reverendsterlin]

if you have a clamping system liquid nails can significantly reduce the number of screws needed. Remember to let it off-gas a couple of weeks regardless.

[Invictus]

Grant - That's awesome advice leaving the screws out a few MM for the stacking units. I was going to just drill some wood "feet" into the bottom, but why bother if the screws do just as well, eh?

Rev - I've never heard of liquid nails... is that just a glue/resin type thing?

[dvs]

Liquid nails is a heavy duty constrution type glue that's in a silicone type tube.... very strong stuff, never use it on anything you might want to take apart again... cuzz it won't happen, at least not without causing some damage. I don't think it would be good for melamine cages either way though.

Grant: about how much would you guess your cages weigh???

[V.hb]

Originally posted by Mason
I have no idea what you are talking about, but it sounds like you are talking about some sort of plastice. My advice to you is to go with the glue, get some aquarium glue from say "Pet Value". Don't use screws, unless you really (think) know what you are doing.

Melemime is really heavy wood coated with plastic. theres no way glue would hold. you definatly need to use the proper screws.

[Grant vg]

dvs, .....hmmmmmmm

I cant really tell you, as i dont have a scale and theres snakes in each one :P
BUt, I can tell you that my 4 x 2 x 1's with 1/4 inch glas in em can easily be lifted by myself. And im a skinny guy.
well, 5'10" and 135-140 lbs.
there light enough that i can stack a good six of them on top of eachother by myself!!
So they're not as heavy as everyone makes it out to be.

When you get into the 5-6 feet cages as well as akwardly shaped ones, it usually is a two person job.

@Invictus, the screws do just as good as any wood. I was going to go the wood route , but it was a pain in the *** to find anything that thin that wouldn't leave such a huge gap and make the cages look uglier.

The screws however, cost nothing extra, and give your cage just enough recess to allow a little space between the heat tape and wood for those of you who are a little paranoid about compressing heat tape with no breathing room.
Goodluck with them!!!

gvg

[dvs]

Grant: thanks man.... I was just trying to get a good idea of what to expect.... I usually don't have anyone else around to help me out with things so I need to make sure I can manage them by myself if need be... and if a skinny guy like you, LOL (hey those were your words ;) ) can handle them then I think I'll be ok.... Im only 5'5" though so I don't think I'll be stack'in them quite that high anyway... I'd still like to actually SEE the snakes :p

[Linds]

Originally posted by Invictus
That's awesome advice leaving the screws out a few MM for the stacking units. I was going to just drill some wood "feet" into the bottom, but why bother if the screws do just as well, eh?


I was actually going to do that for my enclosures but was informed that it wouldn't be a good idea in the long run due to the fact that the screws will be holding all the weight of the cage and its contents, and it can cause it to warp over time. SO I'm opting for the feet or maybe even just those surface savers will suffice.

Originally posted by nuno
Use particle board screws not wood screws they grab much nicer.

I didn't even know these existed. I just used drywall screws because they have the larger threads on them...

Originally posted by V.hb
Melemime is really heavy wood coated with plastic. theres no way glue would hold. you definatly need to use the proper screws.

Carpenters glue is surprisingly strong. People make furniture with glue alone. A good glued joint is much stronger than a screwed one. I use glue/screw comination for everything, and the screws are mostly serving to clamp it while the glue sets. Not sure how strong it would be if applied to the coated portion of melamine.

[Lisa]

We've had no problem using #10 and #8 screws 1 3/4" long with 3/4" melamine. As everyone else said, predrill, don't over tighten. we countersink our screws so they don't scratch when stacked. We have considered doing the dowel thing for stacking cages, but haven't bothered yet.

[dfitzsim]

I've got a few questions. First is heat tape going to work considering the thickness of the wood? Also what do you do about putting glass in? Do you buy 2 pieces of glass and have a sliding front? What do you do about locking it? And do you put in any kind of lights? If you do how are you doing that?

[Invictus]

Heat tape will not work through the wood. Neither will an undertank heater. If you build with a wood bottom, you pretty much have to wire for internal heating, or use a wire mesh top with a heat lamp. I'm personally building an enclosed hood, so the lamps don't really show. The cage itself will have wire mesh on the top.

As for the glass, sliding glass doors are by far the most convenient way of doing it. You just buy a sliding glass door lock to lock it. I don't have any pics offhand or I'd post one.

[V.hb]

Linds, on the glue + screws, dont you find it a pain in the neck to dissassmble the enclosure? Not that it happens often, but in case of a move or anything.... I prefer screws for the convinience.

[asphyxia]

My heat pads work excellent through the melimine, actually to well I need a rehostat to turn the heat down.
Brian

http://www.ssnakess.com/photopost/data/3048/985cage_building_1_002.jpghttp://www.ssnakess.com/photopost/data/3048/985cage_building_nin_use_1_071.jpg

[Invictus]

What type of heat pads do you use? I was talking about your statnard undertank heaters... I've tried using those through wood, and they just don't cut it.

[Lisa]

We are using both exoterra heat pads (17X11" pads) and heat tape on our wood enclosures, both are working great. We have routered out the heat pad sections, but I don't think we had to.