Western Hognose

[Jmail324]

Hello everyone,

I'm a fairly new snake owner, I've had a corn snake and a ball python for nearly two years now. I never stop researching new care info for them, and this forum had been a great deal of help. I was considering buying a western hognose but have read that they are rear fanged, mildy venomous snakes, I was wondering what is meant by mildy venomous, and what a but(if invenomated) would entail. also, any miscellaneous info about the species would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Jared

[NewLineReptile]

I have two Western hognose and yes they are rear fang but nothing to worry about they are not known to bite and even if they did it would not effect you at all they are great snakes however the are like little garbage can's when it comes to eating they will eat and eat good luck

[Matt]

however the are like little garbage can's when it comes to eating

I just wanted to add something to this,
I have found that this is completely true of females, but that males eat alot less and many people have said taht males may only eat 6-12 times a year!

Im sure there are alot of exceptions, but it is important to remember that if you get a male, and they only eat once a month or less...dont stress out, its nothing to be concerned about, its perfectly normal

[Jmail324]

Thanks for your help guys

[Christina]

Jmail
The mildly venomous aspect of the Western Hognose is actually an ongoing debate.
Some say they are and some say they are not. We will never know for sure until the powers to be will actually do a scientific testing on their saliva to prove either or.
As for a pet they are awesome!!! I found the only time mine was aggresive was when he was hungry and that was it.
Remember they like the drier enviroment (we learnt this the hard way:( no comment there please I am still not over that one). They are very susceptible to respitory infections and you do not know that they are showing any signs or symptoms until they actually croak because they will feed right to the end. Water and mist them only once a week. They love to burrow so a shallow sand substrate works great with a few decorative pieces of rocks for shedding purposes.
Have fun go get one and enjoy this beautiful creature.
Christina

[eyespy]

Christina, there's been a large body of work done on Duvernoy's gland secretions in colubrids and venom has been isolated from hognose snakes. Dr. Stephen Mackessy's work is very well accepted by the herp community as proof that they are "warm" snakes, at the least.

http://www.unco.edu/biology/faculty/mackessy_stephen.htm

[XxRachxX]

apparently, or so ive heard.........the hognoses venom could only really be "dangerous" if your allergic to bees and stuff......?? :: shrugs :: my mates just adopted one(its so sweet, its name is bumble!) so we had to do a bit of research:) out of the three ive handled and looked after, they've all been pretty docile anyway? dunno if this is the same will the rest of them though?? oh well....im done!:D

[cyberfrog]

As soon as I find the link for exactly how nasty a Hog bite can be, I'll post it.

[cyberfrog]

Here ya go....
http://www.herpnet.net/bite/

[shaggybill]

XxRachxX, are you saying that if a person is allergic to bees then they are more susceptible to have a bad reaction from a venomous snake bite? Just wonderin...

[Beejay]

I'm curious too. I've considered these snakes but I'm a little weary of the whole anti-coagulating factor. Is it more a factor than the bee-allergy association when it comes to having complications from a bite? What have you found out?

Thanks, Bj

[Jmail324]

Thanks a lot for your imput everyone

[Matt]

i dont think anything has been proven, but some people think that if you are allergic to bees than you could be allergic to other types of venom as well.
I dont know, but my guess is that they are TOTALLY different animals, and I cant see the venom being extreamly similar in content (i may be wrong).
My opinion is that the 2 are totally independent and they cant be compared, but i know people that have thought otherwise!

[eyespy]

Dr. Mackessy's work states that he has isolated a mild hemotoxin, and the reactions he's documented were not allergic reactions, merely localized swelling due to the blood not clotting properly. This has often been confused with the type of swelling a person gets when they have an allergic reaction.

It is also possible to have an allergic reaction to proteins in a snake's saliva, but those are two separate and distinct reactions.

[XxRachxX]

i would have thought it would have been more to do with how your body reacts to venoms, if your body goes mad with bee stings you wont fair too well with a snake bite??know what im getting at?? ......... i dont know!

[eyespy]

I'm deathly allergic to bees and natural rubber latex, to the point where my heart has stopped 14 times and I've had to be rescuscitated but I have no reaction to the hemotoxin in a plains garter snake bite.

An example of one certainly isn't a scientific sample, though, and I've never even held a hognose.

[shaggybill]

Hemotoxin in a plains garter snake? Are you talking about the anti-coagulent properties in their saliva? Is that called hemotoxins?

[eyespy]

Plains and wandering garters have both anticoagulant enzymes and hemotoxins that are secreted by their Duvernoy's gland.

[shaggybill]

So are these hemotoxins something to be real careful about? I know they arent serious like a rattler or something, but what are the affects of it?

[Matt]

the Duv. Gland secretions are not serious at all, unlesss you are allergic to a protein in it....but the secreation in itself, is nothing like rattler hemotoxins

[eyespy]

It can't even kill a bullfrog so people are safe, the worst that happens is a wicked bruise.