***Some Rattler Pics***

[Matt]

Felt like posting some pics,
these are two pics of the many rattlers that i spent alot of time around while in kentucky

<i>Crotalus durissus terrificus</i>
http://www.ssnakess.com/photopost/data/500/20cdt1-med.jpg

<i>Crotalus durissus culminatus</i>
she was a little over-weight!
http://www.ssnakess.com/photopost/data/500/20cdc-med.jpg

[BWSmith]

Very pretty. durissus, not that is a hot snake! CroFab has even had limited success treating them!

[Matt]

generally, terrificus got the attitude to go with it too! :eek:
hey BW, I know that crofab isnt the greatest on durissus, but whats your opinion on BioClon.
I have heard that BioClon has a bit of a better track record againt the durissus. Id feel more comfortable using it over CroFab!

[ReptileHQ]

doesn't the Mexican Anticrotalico neutralize durissus venom pretty well, BWsmith?

Chris

[shaggybill]

Dang, how do you guys know so much about antivenom? I've never even heard of BioClon and that Mexican Anticroticalodoroerwqewbuiibkjef stuff.

[nuno]

Thoes are amazing...wow!!:D

[BWSmith]

CroFab appears as though it was specifically designed for the the venomous snakes of the Southeastern US. While the Canebrake and EDB have neurotoxins, durissus is nototious for having very neurotoxic venom. I believe that Anticrotalico is actually derived from durissus venom which would naturally make it more effective. But I am at work and dont have any of my books here ;) It would also stand to reason, since both Anticrotalico and BioClon are produced in mexico, durissus would be a major portion of each. I do not recall seeing durissus on the list of snakes used for CroFab.

I have heard that both Anticrotalico and BioClon work well, but that is just in passing conversations. I have not read anything regarding actual results from treatment, recovery times, or instinces of serum sickness. So I am pretty much going by memory and logical conclusions. So forgive me if some conclusions are no correct. Being int he US, I try to focus on CroFab and have followed it's progress. This is simply die to the fact that it is what is used. Perhaps the 2 other Crot AVs could follow along the lines of CroFab and get away from horse serum, CroFab seems to be about easiest AV on the body. But now I am curious as to actual case studies on BioClon and Anticrotalico. I never put much effort into it since it is not available here. well, not readily available ;)

[Matt]

If memory serves isnt CroFab made from:
adamanteus (EDB)
atrox (WDB)
scutulatus (mojave)
horridus (timber)

thats off the top of my head, someone correct me if Im wrong.

Because of the OUTRAGEOUS price of CroFab, I was thinking about importing some BioClon from Mexico.

[BWSmith]

That sounds about right. I have all the documentation that Savage Labs sent me at the house. Very good stuff although alot of it is propaganda type info. But that list seems accurate, i am just trying to remember if there is one more in there.

[ReptileHQ]

Matt, sorry to crush your hopes of aquiring Antivenin...but there is no way a private citizen in Canada can legally import antivenin of any kind. My friend owns an accredited zoo here and he has a hard enough time getting the stuff.

Problem is, it has to be prescribed by a doctor. "Hey doc I need the stuff for when I get wailed by my mamba"...."Okay Matt no problem...here's 10 vials" LOL...you get the point...no doctor in his right mind would prescribe it in this country. The best thing for you to do is to get in contact with keepers who have access to AV. PM me and I can get you in touch with the right people.

Chris

[BWSmith]

It is the same here. There are miles of red tape since mostof the exotic AV is not even aproved by the FDA.

[Matt]

ahhh. ;)
i have some friends that i have been working with to get some in.
There are a couple of routes i was trying to take,
and believe it or not, i actually found a doctor that is cooperating with me on this, working on getting the IND# now.

I have already spoke with a couple AV producers, and some of the companies have only a 10 vial limit, so that shouldnt be a problem.

The IND# takes care of the fact that it isnt FDA approved

BUT, these things always have a way of falling through :)

[Matt]

oh, and about the CroFab thing, i think I remember something about maybe cottonmouth venom in there too????
BW, let me know when you get home and check it out!

[Feed'em All]

hey! I'm so proud you american guys (I know some of you are candian..lol) love the rattler of my country! Believe me guys, Crotalus Durissus Terrificus is really feared in here (just look at his name meaning "terrifying").
I personally think some other argentinian ven. (bothrops) are more beautiful, but I am all proud though!
By the way, do some research about the antivenin made in the Malbran Institute, Argentina, maybe you can import that one (which is made of terrificus).
Martin.

[paolo_28]

Very nice.

[marylyn101]

So cute :)