Scale Rot pics

[snake_girl]

Okay here are some pictures of the scale rot My BP has gotten. These pictures were taken a few days ago and she had just been to the vet a week ago and received an injection of antibiotics and I was giving her Enrofloxcin .2 mls orally for ten days. I'd also and still am applying polysporin 2x daily to the infected area.

Its not getting any better and I know this post belongs in the Python form I just thought more ppl would respond here. I’m really not sure what to do I called the vet and he told me to wait a few days, but the infected scales as you can see in the pictures are pulling off and the scales under the infected area are raw and some times bleed. It looks very painful...

If anyone can tell me anything I would very my appreciate it. Because my vet knows nothing (he wrote on her chart that her scale rot was on her back which it is not!) My funds are running low (he charged me 60.00 to see him, 48.00 for the injection and 26.00 for the Enrofloxcin and that’s pretty much cleaned out my snake fund so I’m not sure what to do.)

I’ve never dealt with this before so if everyone feels I should take her to another vet (money or no money) I will. But I need to know if I’m overreacting (Tend to do that often) But I don't see how I can be now I mean it looks pretty bad.

Any advise would be great!
Thanks a lot
Grace

ps: make sure you trust the person completely before leaving your animals with them. I learned from my foolish mistake and it will never happen again.




<P><C>This is the most infected area as close up as we could to get a clear picture the brownish part thats peeling up is what I'm worried about.
<img src=http://www.ssnakess.com/photopost/data/500/10964837861etcsqr_ph-med.jpg></P></C>

<P><C>this is the hole infected area give or take a few inches.
<img src=http://www.ssnakess.com/photopost/data/500/1094433-med.jpg></P></C>
<P><C>This is the close up on the raw area where the infected scales are pulling off you can sorta see the redish bleeding area that looks like a large scratch
<img src=http://www.ssnakess.com/photopost/data/500/109more-med.jpg></P></C>

[Just Me]

I find that so hard to look at. How long did you leave it with the person???

I don't know if you're just overreacting, but I hope the meds work.

Good luck.

[snake_girl]

she was with my "Friend" for a month and a half while i moved, over the phone she'd told me it was just a heat burn and I told her to put polysporin on it, i dunno i guesss she was just to busy :mad:

thanks for your support I'm sorry the pics are so hard to look at its not pretty i know

Grace

[The_Omen]

That is not scale rot.

Here's some good ways to tell.
Is it all localized to the subcaudal scales?

Are there any signs of it on any of the upper body scales?

And sniff it.
Smell kinda rank?

Scale rot this advanced will be all over the snakes body and will not advance quite that quickly and suddenly over that span.

Have a hot rock or a UTH without a thermostat in there?

The snake needs stronger meds than that for this.
It needs baytril or amakacin given either injectible or orally for a few weeks until this clears up other wise it can turn nasty.
(oral and inj. is the same dosage, if oral meds, do not feed while on the medicine)

Have you changed the substrate to either news print or housing it in a temp home of a plastic tote with no substrate at all and heated with a heating pad on low or medium, depending on the thickness of the plastic?

Change the water daily, sterilizint the water bowl daily as well, using a bowl too small to soak in and go see the vet again at the FIRST sign of infection.
Which is probably already started, so you don't want it going systemaitic.

[paul_le_snake]

seen this before and i had a ball python that cooked itself! put on aloe vera lotion from the body shop. it works a treat.
cheers
paul

[ETET]

This looks like a burn of your BP. The medication your vet gave you should be OK for now. If its still no good, a culture of the skin lesion should require to determine which antibiotic is the best one to use. In addition, a soak in a povidine iodine solution/Nolvasan (chlorhexidine) for 30 min per day before applying polysporin will be helpful. In severe case, 2-4 weeks of injectable antibiotics and 4-6 weeks of polysporin may require.

Another thing is that burns heal slowly. It may takes a few skin sheds to heal completely. During these skin sheds, you may still see raw tissue; but when the skin grows it should get smaller and smaller until heal up completely. Good luck to your BP!


ETET

[eyespy]

Enrofloxacin is Baytril, just the generic name, so I think the vet gave the proper antibiotic treatment. So the most important thing is keeping the affected area clean as described by The Omen and ETET.

Burns take much longer to heal in reptiles than in us humans because we shed our skin cells daily and regenerate new ones. Reptiles' skin is totally different in its regeneration and it can take several shed cycles to really see normal tissue growth after what looks like a fairly deep burn.

Of course, I'm not a vet so don't take this as any sort of treatment plan and medical advice. I am a former veterinary surgical tech who has seen a lot of burn injuries though, and that's what it looks like to me. To me it looks like she was coiled around either a hot rock or a light fixture.

[The_Omen]

Almost forgot..
on the polysporin, neosporin or other type of antimicrobial creams, be sure to use the plain, non pain relief type.


Enrofloxacin is Baytril, just the generic name

Good point. You get used to calling something one thing for years and when you see it called by another name, sometimes it doesn't immediately hit you....

She does need to stay hydrated as well, but with no soaking, unless in the topical mix suggested, then she needs to be given fluids orally (straight pedialyte) if not drinking on her own.

If still giving meds orally now, give the oral hydration a few hours after giving meds to have time for the absorption of the meds.(You said daily orals)
If not on meds now, then anytime is good for oral fluids.

Burns 101 -
Typically most burns are actually very clean injuries with most bacterias etc killed in the process of receiving the burn. The treatment within the first hours(on a human) are critical to the outcome.
In reptiles the treatment is even more critical as sometimes the burn is not quite as evident, animal is allowed to remain in the cage crawling on used substrate that may carry harmful pathogens which can lead to a major innfection if not treated in time.
Another thing that burn victims have in their disfavor is the dehydration due to fluid loss at the burn site. Humans on one hand are larger than most reptiles kept, and can be placed into a medically induced coma while being treated, receiving meds, saline etc and our systems can handle more due to our much faster metabolism.
Reptile burn victims are typically smaller, have even less fluids to lose and can't be placed into a comatose state for treatment as it would kill them.
Dehydration is a big killer in burn victims either just plain dehydrated to death or over a period of time as the internal organs lose functions from the loss of fluids.
The fluid loss, althougth not always apparent, is due to the loss of the skin and or the loss of the skins ability to heal itself for a short time, allowing fluids to seep from the affected areas.

Hydration is an important factor for this and for survival.

[snake_girl]

okay well, I do have a heat pad that was hotter then most so i covered it more so that it wasn't as hot.

the thing is the infection spread a little, I mean it was just the really bad area where the scale was brown and peeling but then it carried down her belly but not to fare.

it does seem right though because before the scales would dry up they would bluster frist which is what burns do.

I do have her in a clean cage with paper towel so I can see if its drianed or not (which it has alot) and it doesn't have an unpleasnt oder to it.

I'm really worried, can this be treated? will it go away?
thanks
Grace

oh yes and she is drinking on her own I made sure but she has stoped eating which i know is only normal.

[snake_girl]

I was going to give her a soak in a 10:1 bactine(sp?) soulition, is that recommended or should I use Iodine?

I aslo have this stuff called Spectro Jel which is recommened for peircings and it washes away bacteria and its unscented should I us some of that as well?

also one of my friend had a really bad accident and brunt her had she got this cream to apply to the brunt areas should I ask if I could borrow some of that or am i geting carried away?

thanks again for all of your help everyone

Grace

[The_Omen]

Stay away from the ear cream and the burn creams.

[Dino]

Hey Snake Girl! I have just recently obtained a rescue/adoption with the exact same problem. I am going to tell you what my vet told me! I am not an expert in any way I am just going to relay that info to you.

First of all ...switch to overhead heat..get a lamp or ceramic emiter. The heat on the belly is not good, it is uncomfortable and the snake will have problem regulating. The heat also breeds bacteria.

I change the substrate twice a day or as needed. I use paper towel, I was recomender this or newpaper ....without print!

I soak him in a warm betadine solution watered down to the color of week tea. Once a day for about 10min. After which I blot and dab the infected area with clean paper towel. The odd scale does come off. I purchased the betadine from the local drugstore for $13.00 Canadian per 1 ltr. I do this in the morning.

At night I apply a liberal amount of polysporin. Ever morning I wake up and change the substrate because it will seep out and leave the paper covered in a greenish puss.

I have been keeping everthing as clean as possible to provent any further infection. Like The Omen said fresh water and a clean bowl.

In a nutshell I have followed this regime without fail. So far so good, this seems to be working even though it has only been a week. I am going to be following this thread because I am learning along with you and hopefully we both get a couple of very healthy snakes from this :)

btw you are right about leaving a pet with a freind! The guy that I adopted this ball python from did the same thing.

Cheers
Dino

This was taken after a good cleaning in the first couple of days

http://www.ssnakess.com/photopost/data/500/355im00044911.jpg

[snake_girl]

Thank you, THANK YOU! you have no idea how much you've all helped me! I thank you all from the bottom of my heart for your guidance.
and Dino I hope so too! good luck with your snake!

Grace

[Ritus_Reptile]

snake_girl sorry to hear about your BP mine got burnt too a couple years ago. I put him in a glass fish tank and used a heat lamp over top with paper towels on the bottom of the tank. I now use a heat pad under the tank on the out side(it is an adhesive pad) so the snake is never directly on it. There are no inconvenient wires running out of the tank this way. And if you must use a heat rock which i strongly apose, you can just wrap a thick rag around it. The recovery from the burn was slow for my bp, even after 2 sheds it was still raw. But hes fine now and his were a little more severe. I think your bp with do just fine, everyone gave you a bunch of good tips no need to worry too much. I hope you and your bp the best of luck.

[Gregg M]

That snake was kept way too humid...... I had a gaboon that was being kept in poor conditions befor I got her that had this...... What I did was I used a powdered form of med that is used to treat fungus infections in fish....... I would soak her every other day in a tub of water with the medication mixed in...... After she shed all the scale rot was gone...... You will not see any change until your snake sheds....... This is serious and could kill your snake....... I will get the name of the medication I used and let you know...... I will also tell you how to mix it correctly....... If you take the proper steps your snake should be fine

[Lisa]

For your heat pad you should be using a rheostat or thermostat. You can buy a rheostat at any petstore or see the link to building one in the eclosure creations forum

[snake_girl]

The Betadine I got was hard to find and it’s used for surgery?? It’s a Surgical scrub and its like a reddish brownish colour that does look like weak tea to me when I mix it in to warm water, so I’m assuming this is the stuff I should be using right? If its not what should I do

thanks agian for everyones help!
Grace

[Gregg M]

Why is everyone sating its a burn???? It is not a burn it is a fungus infectiom...... Using medication that is used to treat burns will not do any good for this snake....... First thing you need to do is put your snake on a dry substrate and make sure it stays clean..... Go to the pet store and get medication that is used to treat ick, scale rot, hole in the head, and other FUNGUS infections that fish get....... Mix it in a big tub of water....... I sould be yellow...... It should be as yellow as pee like when you take too many vitamines....... Soak the snake for 1 hour every other day....... This will help your snake....... You will not see anything until the snake sheds....... I have seen this on a few occations..... I will get the exact name of the medicaion for you by this afternoon.......

[The_Omen]

Greg...
Read the entire post again.

Even if this is scale rot, which is very seriously doubted, then it has progressed to the point of being systematic and does need stronger meds. (I don't see any signs of scalerot on the side scales) That and the bad spot, where you can see the hottest spot was, whether hot rock or bulb.(unknown)

Incedentally, the internal meds AND the topicals for the treatment are basically the same for a burn as scalerot.

[Phantom]

WoW! I am learning so much from this disscussion! My adult male bp is experiencing the same thing, althought the stage he is at is not as advanced or serious as snake_girl's.

I've been treating him for a week and I'm waiting to see the vet to get a medical examination. My appointment is on the 8th of march, unfortunatly there was nothing available earlier :(

Phantom

[Dino]

Yes....Snake Girl That is the stuff! Just mix it to a light orange color but still very transperant! It doesn't take that much into the bottom of a tupperware contaner, I us an old margerine tub! Just enough to cover the snakes belly. Keep a close eye on the water temperature because it will drop quickly. 10 min should be long enough. It is an antiseptic (0.75% Iodine I think) so you can't mess it up to bad :) Offer the snake a drink of fresh water before you soak it so it doesn't try to drink the betadine solution ;). Then just dab dry with clean paper towel.

Cheers
Dino

[snake_girl]

Or somthing worked because this morning when I went to her tank to change her paper towels and apply polysporin she had a nice big shed in the front of her hide.

I took her out turned her over and all the brownish scales were gone! now all she has is a few raw pinkish areas that I'll watch carfully and I'm still going to bath her in the Betadine and apply polysopoin for the rest of the week! I'm soo happy I was so afriad that this was going to get worse!

Now I hope the same thing happens to you Dino! goodluck!

Grace

[Lisa]

Good to hear the snake is getting better.

[Dino]

Thats Awesome Grace! I would still keep a good eye on it though.

I hope mine has a shed soon!

Cheers
Dino

[unknownclown]

UGH THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR POSTING THIS!:)
I bought a BP at a pet store last month with the same thing Ive been worried that it was something contagious.
By any chance would this give the snake a bad disposition? The reason I ask is mine will strike any time you reach in the tank or sometimes go near it. There is nothing else that I can see wrong with her aside from whomever dropped her off at the pet store didnt take care of her and she has some very nasty scar tissue.

[eyespy]

That's a bigtime yes, unkownclown! A snake in discomfort is a bitey kind of thing.

[J_Riley]

I'm glad to hear the snake in question is getting better, hurray!

[Gregg M]

Told you so......LOL....... But seriously I am glad your snake is OK...... Do not keep her on soaking wet substrate........ It sould be abkle to be misted but also should be able to dry up pretty quick.......

[snake_girl]

what do you mean told you so? I'm lost :( do you mean that it was scale rot like you had said all along, if so how do you know it was scale rot was it because it went away so quickly because it hasn't gone away its still there its just the main infected area was shed off I'm sure it will slowly go away but she still has the infection. or do you mean that burns dont shed like that or somthing?

thanks
Grace

[garethuk1]

to me that is not scale rot but it looks like she has been burned by a heat bulb