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Lefitte
09-21-16, 03:24 AM
So, I know I have probably asked this before, but it's still bugging me. I'll also start by saying that I don't care what my snake is, she's my pain in the butt and I love her anyway. I'm also never planning to breed her so I know that I will never have a definitive answer to this question, however...

My girl Eir just keeps lightening up. She's looking more and more like a hypo every day. It really makes me wonder how genetics works here. Here's what I know:
She was sold as an aberrant California kingsnake.
I know somewhere in her genes she seems to have Newport locality because her markings are very clearly Newport.
Many Newport adults seem to lighten to a brown color, that still looks darker than hers. They also seem to have more yellow than she does.
She has blue grey eyes.

This is her today, in shed but fairly normal color in low lighting.
https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/14359111_10210732970105476_1370838920556819765_n.j pg?oh=0cec38c146dedd6d2736ae075c5eb11b&oe=587B1CEC

When she's in better lighting or sun, you can really see how pale her color is.
https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/14390757_10210732963465310_3738899874741675773_n.j pg?oh=93c1230b657a10bb380a4f92dfe7751b&oe=587E2F9C

She has a milky sheen over her chocolate color that almost makes it look on the lavender side at times, though not that pale.
https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/14354964_10210732964145327_8936994254673935125_n.j pg?oh=f4d2e62eba701079ab4f3541c67c926b&oe=5883F68E

Very true representation of her color.
https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/14448773_10210732964385333_6491152208762559160_n.j pg?oh=cecbfbab0784b5c263f6d44c735fd963&oe=587E9940

And this was her as a baby. A dark brown and offwhite or cream color.
https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/14448891_10210732983065800_8029424314134733667_n.j pg?oh=90f6a1726a47b13f6cc8af9c6111788a&oe=5868F695

I heard someone mention a 'dark hypo' once and they posted a pic that looked similar to Eir which has caused a lot of confusion for me.

I know hypo is the lack of, but not total erase of, melanin.
But what defines a hypo? What do you look for in a hypo? When can you decide if a snake is hypo?

My confusion here mostly lies in the fact that it looks like she'll eventually end up looking just like a hypo adult. However, I've been told that she's not hypo at all because she was dark as a baby. Is there some other gene at play here? Do kings usually lighten up THIS much because I haven't often seen it?
If two snakes look exactly the same as adults but one was born light and one was born darker, how do they genetically look so similar and yet one be a hypo and one be normal?

I really am honestly curious about how the genetics work here. Like I said, I like her anyway and I don't plan on breeding so I can't test out her genetics, I'm just curious how this works. Since I don't know and understand what's going on with her and it seems abnormal [if she were just lightening up to brown and yellow then I wouldn't be so surprised], and that makes me very curious. I've tried to research but I've come up empty, so help me out?

chairman
09-21-16, 06:58 AM
The definition of hypo is somewhat moot because snake morphs weren't established by biologists with the labs and equipment necessary to determine which pigments were present in a particular snake. Instead, amateurs gave it a shot based on their knowledge of biology and what they could visually observe. Many of these assumptions have been very good, while some labels are misleading and annoying.

To my knowledge, in kings, hypo refers to reduced dark pigment but not an absence. Absence would be found in the albinos. Excessive dark pigment would be the hypers, usually called chocolates or nitidias.

In the case of your snake, it looks like it was born with the pigment so it isn't hypo. But some localities go brown with age, so you must have a snake with that background.

Lefitte
09-22-16, 01:04 AM
Ah, I thought they were established, or at least heavily adjusted, by biologists. That makes a lot of sense.

I wonder if Eir's genes are similar to dogs who have a greying gene that slowly changes them over time.

Do you know anything about the "Mocha morph"? I was doing some research and the Californiakingsnakes weebly site was talking about a mocha morph where they start off dark and lighten and lumped it in with the hypos as well but at the time that was written there were only a few?

It's kind of funny. I originally wanted a very black and white king and I bought one and then ended up having her trying really hard to pretend she's hypo. It's made things more intriguing and fun than if she'd stayed that a color haha.