Need some feeding help for GBK.

[TxScarlet15]

I am legitimately starting to get worried now about Scarlet Rose. This is my previous thread about my feeding woes with her http://www.ssnakess.com/forums/lampropeltis/110135-weight-loss.html.
A complete rundown of the last couple months:
6/31 fed
7/12 weight 297
7/22 took her to the vet (not for her feeding issues)
7/29 she went blue then shed on 8/05
8/15 weight 275
8/18 fed (this was the first brained attempt, before she refused all other food offered)
9/04 fed (again brained)
9/09 weight 293
9/25 shed
9/28 weight 271.
I had tried to feed her again around 9/23? but hadn't realized she was in shed so of course she didn't take it. Last night I tried going all out, put Scarlet in a box in a dark place, scented a f/t with live and brained it. Tossed it into the box and it's still there this morning. I'm really worried at this point because I don't even have to weigh her to tell she's thin (handling has been to an absolute minimum). I had wanted to try brumating her this winter so that maybe she would have a bit better feeding response come spring, but I'm kinda scared to at this point. Am I just being a spaz?

[Bandit]

Just curious, how old is the snake and how long have you had her? How did you feed her before she went off feed? I know f/t but could you give me specifics on the process?

Some of this could be irrelevant, but I just want as much info as I can get before offering up some advice.

[TxScarlet15]

I don't know her age unfortunately. I've had her for about 6 years I think, honestly can't remember now but that seems about right, so that makes her a bit older than I originally thought, 8+ is what I'm thinking. I believe her previous owner fed her live, or at least stunned/pre-killed, if I'm remembering correctly. I've fed her f/t since I got her, and she's always been a finicky eater but never this bad, nor have I ever been able to visibly see her weight loss, which I think is what scares me the most.

[TxScarlet15]

Oh sorry missed the part about "specifics", I thaw the mouse by letting it sit at room temperature for maybe an hour, then I thaw it the rest of the way in lukewarm/warm water. The same as how I've done it all these years and how I do it with my other two snakes as well (they are both monsters at feeding time, especially the MBK.)

[Bandit]

Well it sounds like you've got a good routine. Considering how old she is, it's odd that she's giving you problems. I've dealt with snakes that have gone off feed for way longer and had no problems, but the loss of weight is concerning.

Maybe try spiking up those water temps a bit to make the mouse really warm, and then give it a lot of movement on the tongs.

If she continues to not eat and lose weight, I'd bring her to the vet.

[Sylphie]

Did you tried boiled? My problematic corn is feeding her f/t only if I thaw the mices in boiling water.

As Bandit said everything seems fine, but if she's losing a lot of weight then I recommend vet visit too. When my problematic was eating and losing a lot of weight she was having protozoa, and after taking medicine everything is fine now. Maybe yours is having some type of parasites too, and thats why she's losing weight.

[TxScarlet15]

Would I need to take her to the vet to get a fecal test or could I just bring in a sample to test? I want to limit her stress as much as possible but at the same time how long is too long of this cycle of not eating and weight loss?
Bandit, I did try a couple times of warming the mouse up really good and wiggling it a lot, she was always interested at first, would rush up to it but then lose interest (sometimes even get startled by it) and after that it was game over. I even tried mimicking a live mouse by scooching it around on the substrate, nothing. Tried pressing the mouse to her snout as was suggested in my other thread, she would always flinch or jerk away and definitely didn't want it then.

[TxScarlet15]

Did you tried boiled? My problematic corn is feeding her f/t only if I thaw the mices in boiling water.
Do you just toss the mouse in a pot? For how long? Silly question I know, but I never thought to try boiling it. It doesn't cook it or anything?

[Sylphie]

You can just take a sample for test, but it must be fresh. And as to boiling.. I'm just boiling the water, then I pour it to the mug, I'm putting the mice in small ziploc bag and then I'm putting it to the mug. After 2-3 minutes it's done and I'm giving it to the snake (you can check if it's not too hot, if yes then just wait a moment until the temperature will drop a little). I know that mices shouldn't be boiled at all but thats the only way for mine to want it.

[EL Ziggy]

The weight loss doesn't seem too significant. Both of my kings are hit or miss right now too. If your husbandry is on point and she seems healthy I wouldn't worry. Be careful with the boiling water. It can cause some feeders to burst. I prefer to thaw the feeders in luke warm water then I super heat them with a blow dryer to about 100F. I'd just keep offering food every 2 weeks until they're back on track. Best wishes TX.

[Sylphie]

Yeah, the boiling isn't recommended at all, but if everything would fail then it's worth a try. Like I said for my problematic feeder it's the only way, so I think that I should mention it :D

[jjhill001]

297, 275, 293, 271.

The higher weights are always a little after you feed the snake.

Seems like some weight fluctuation based on feeding but its not insane. Can you see ribs or anything?

Try waiting 2 weeks before offering food. Then you can try the good ole paper bag trick, thaw the mouse then put it in some WARM not boiled water, basically about as hot as your faucet will get for about 2-5 minutes. Put the mouse in the paper bag, add the snake. Fold the top over a few times, put it back in the terrarium overnight.

Hopefully you wake up and the mouse is gone.

I always warm up mouse, I wouldn't want to boil it because that seems like it would cook the mouse and make it have different nutritional properties/leave hot spots within the guts.

[TxScarlet15]

Thank you everyone for the input. I'll wait a full 2 weeks this time and try again, hopefully she'll eat. As of right now I can't see her ribs, but I can feel them more than I used to. In general she just seems to have a more gaunt look to her than normal, especially along her topline, but it can be kind of deceiving with her strange lumpy spine (visit this thread for info on that http://www.ssnakess.com/forums/general-discussion/109815-worried-about-kinky-spine.html). And you are probably right, I was weighing her on bad days to get an accurate weight. Okay, time to stop fretting and be patient.