finally gonna get my BP! first snake! tips anyone?

[AlexCrazy]

HI! my dreams are finally gonna come true! im gonna get a male BP..
i would love some tips! name ideas... and i have a cuestion..
can i use dry-id leaves for beading? it will look really natural... theres lots.. and its one of my only option other than shavings....
:D level of happiness is so freaking high! hahahaha soo happy!
and my tank size is 24x63 inches.. is it okay? i know they say not to use big.. but my wallet is small and it was my dads old fishtank..

[AlexCrazy]

All so.. is it okay to..(for the meantime) fead hamster fuzzys? my seller cant send me frozen or live food :( then ill get the mice..

[Albert Clark]

Congrats Alex! I am happy for you. I really wouldn't use leaves from outside bc they may harbor bugs and elements that may be unhealthy for your bp, first piece of equipment you will need is a thermostat to regulate the heat. Paper towels are a good clean floor covering and can make it easy to see areas that need cleaning. A couple of hides to give a sense of security to the bp. Make sure to divide the enclosure into a warm side and cool side for him as well. And a water bowl.

[AlexCrazy]

Thanks! I bouhgt 2 thermo/hydrometers and a heat pad.
Don't snakes go around leaves in the wild? I guess they could have some sort of dirt.. or i dont know.. but it seams pretty natural and normal to me..
Im still wondering about the hamster thing :( i dont whant to feed the rong thing..

[MDT]

Alex..dried leaves are fine. Lots of people use dried leaves. You're correct...snakes are all up in the dried leaves in the wild. Same with ingesting bits of substrate....snakes do that in the wild too...with no ill effects. However...you gotta have your husbandry spot on. In captivity they don't have the luxury of being able to adjust over distance like they can in the wild. Your snake is confined to a relatively small ecosystem. If it isn't what their physiology requires, then bad stuff happens...and it's all on you.

I personally use manageable substrate (cage liners, paper towels, newspaper, etc), it's just easier for me to clean. Currently, I'm using a material from cageliners.net and covering with cypress mulch.

My guess is that after you've changed your leaves a few times when your Python drops a big dump and smears it around, you'll be looking for a new substrate 😀....

Post up pics when you can!!

[ManSlaughter33]

I would say no to the hamsters...

[AlexCrazy]

I would say no to the hamsters...
why? i read there aggressive.. but its just until i find the mice.. hes coming on sort of a short notice..my dad found one at last.. so.. my weekend is gonna be busy!
Ill maybe use the leaves.. but to be safe.. ill start with paper towels! thanks everyone for the advice.. its nice to have support on something so important! :D

[DDW]

why? i read there aggressive.. but its just until i find the mice.. hes coming on sort of a short notice..my dad found one at last.. so.. my weekend is gonna be busy!

The aggression isn't the reason I think. They are a lot of fur with little nutritional value to make up for it. That and some snakes, like ball/royal pythons, tend to get stuck on a particular prey item and refuse anything else. Picky eaters are not a good thing to work with. You should be able to order f/th online and get them next day shipping I think. I think it would be better to put off until you can get appropriate prey items unless the snake is supper skinny. Snakes can go for long periods of time without food without much more than a little lost weight. A few days won't hurt. And I think bps somtimes get hooked on mice and refuse rats when the time comes also but I throw that one to more experience people. How long until you can get those mice? All else fails, ask the previous owner where they got the snakes food. They should know for sure how to get hold of some.

[AlexCrazy]

ahhh.. i could also shave them HAHA but yes.. the picky part i forgot..
depending on the info that the seller will give me about his diet.. ill se if i will wait..
but i will have to change for sure one day... my dad will only accept rats in the house if they are necesary.. so it will have to be mice for now... ill try not to start on hamsters..
the funny thing is that the seller seed theres no problem with feading him hamster O.o

[DDW]

Hmm:/I'm just stating the reason hamsters are usually not used. And if I remember corectly, rats are just a little more fat content (which I'm not saying is badXD) why will he not allow rats but allow mice?

[AlexCrazy]

Im not 100% sure... but he just dosent like rats... ha ha
mice are cuter in a way... XD maybe ill even just have rabbits and not rats... it will depend on his mood at that time.. ha ha

[DDW]

Rats tend to have better dispositions(my sister had pet rats) and usually easier to handle. But rabbits are usually used for the larger snakes. Idk if bps ever get big enough for them.

[SnoopySnake]

Ball pythons won't get big enough for rabbits.

[Aaron_S]

Ball pythons won't get big enough for rabbits.

It's happened before. Just need small rabbits.

[SnoopySnake]

It's happened before. Just need small rabbits.

Is it worth it though? I mean, nutritionally... Would an adult rat be better?

[Aaron_S]

Is it worth it though? I mean, nutritionally... Would an adult rat be better?

No fricking clue. I personally don't want to 1. pay rabbit prices 2. have to search out small rabbits.

Honestly, I think people are splitting hairs on the whole nutritional value thing. When snakes, and each species, has been properly analyzed on when it's best in their growth cycle to have more protein, fat or etc. Then I'll worry more about nutritional content on food items.

It's sort of putting the cart before the horse in my eyes.

[AlexCrazy]

I guess the nutitional value depens on how you feed the food items.. (just thinkikng) if you make the mouse fat.. it could have the same value sort of as the rat.. if you make the rat exercise more.. the rat could have less fat than the mouse...

[Albert Clark]

Thanks! I bouhgt 2 thermo/hydrometers and a heat pad.
Don't snakes go around leaves in the wild? I guess they could have some sort of dirt.. or i dont know.. but it seams pretty natural and normal to me..
Im still wondering about the hamster thing :( i dont whant to feed the rong thing..

Snakes in the wild are different from snakes in captivity. Wild snakes harbor more ectoparasites and more endoparasites. So, what we try to do as keepers is to maintain a level of safety for our captives and not expose them to unnecessary conditions that are inherent to the wild population. There is a higher standard of care for captive reptiles. Even the wild caught animals wind up faring better in captivity. But their physical conditions are a testament to the dangers and risks that they are exposed to in the wild. So, just be sure to get all the aphids, slugs, and slime off of the wild outside leaves as well as any tick larvae and microscopic insectivores that may or may not be visible. Just a IMO. :hmm: Oh, and I was referring to a thermostat not a thermometer for your heat regulation.

[ManSlaughter33]

I still think hamsters are a no.... they dont grow big enoug hfor an adult BP, and they probably get hooked on them..

[prairiepanda]

Honestly, I think people are splitting hairs on the whole nutritional value thing. When snakes, and each species, has been properly analyzed on when it's best in their growth cycle to have more protein, fat or etc. Then I'll worry more about nutritional content on food items.


I agree; we don't know what fat/protein and nutrient ratios snakes actually need, so comparing nutrition values is pointless. There are differences between different prey items, sometimes very big differences, but we don't know what the significance of those differences is.

As for hamsters vs mice...well, there are a few different species of hamsters in the pet trade. The larger species would get to a pretty good size for an adult BP; probably better to have one big hamster than a few little mice for a meal...but hamsters cost way more than mice. Not to mention it seems like not many people(if any) feed exclusively hamsters, so we don't have any data to show whether such a diet would be too fatty or contain too much hair or whatever for a snake over a long period. I imagine it would be fine occasionally, but for a staple diet I'd stick to feeders that have been tested by many generations of snake keepers.

[Aaron_S]

I agree; we don't know what fat/protein and nutrient ratios snakes actually need, so comparing nutrition values is pointless. There are differences between different prey items, sometimes very big differences, but we don't know what the significance of those differences is.

As for hamsters vs mice...well, there are a few different species of hamsters in the pet trade. The larger species would get to a pretty good size for an adult BP; probably better to have one big hamster than a few little mice for a meal...but hamsters cost way more than mice. Not to mention it seems like not many people(if any) feed exclusively hamsters, so we don't have any data to show whether such a diet would be too fatty or contain too much hair or whatever for a snake over a long period. I imagine it would be fine occasionally, but for a staple diet I'd stick to feeders that have been tested by many generations of snake keepers.

I agree. I only worry about comparing mice vs. rats as those are the staples in the industry for most species.

I try not to re-invent the wheel when I don't need to. Mice and rats have raised decades worth of snakes and I don't see any reason that needs to change at this time. It's one less thing for me to worry about as a keeper.

However, I do try to find feeders who have been raised well including a good diet.

[AlexCrazy]

I agree.. i just asked cos in this country its the most aveilable.. it would only be until i find mice to start breeding... il try to stay of the hamsters.. but.. if i dont find the mice soon.. i cant leave it to starve. O.o

[Aaron_S]

I agree.. i just asked cos in this country its the most aveilable.. it would only be until i find mice to start breeding... il try to stay of the hamsters.. but.. if i dont find the mice soon.. i cant leave it to starve. O.o

If you can't find mice or rats try african soft furs. I think they are a mice? Maybe a rat. Anyway it's something people have come to use in the hobby as a feeder with ball pythons.

Here's how you rank source of food for ball pythons.

Rats
ASF
Mice
Gerbils










Hamsters

[sophiedufort]

HI! my dreams are finally gonna come true! im gonna get a male BP..
i would love some tips! name ideas... and i have a cuestion..
can i use dry-id leaves for beading? it will look really natural... theres lots.. and its one of my only option other than shavings....
:D level of happiness is so freaking high! hahahaha soo happy!
and my tank size is 24x63 inches.. is it okay? i know they say not to use big.. but my wallet is small and it was my dads old fishtank..

Tips? Be unconventional :D

[AlexCrazy]

If you can't find mice or rats try african soft furs. I think they are a mice? Maybe a rat. Anyway it's something people have come to use in the hobby as a feeder with ball pythons.

Here's how you rank source of food for ball pythons.

Rats
ASF
Mice
Gerbils










Hamsters
Did you rank them for there size.. or just named them?
If gerbils are okay.. i think i cound go with that.. it has a tail wich will make feeding easier for me.. and ive seen them in petstores... i would have to read about them.. dont now anything about size or... anything.. ha ha

[Aaron_S]

Did you rank them for there size.. or just named them?
If gerbils are okay.. i think i cound go with that.. it has a tail wich will make feeding easier for me.. and ive seen them in petstores... i would have to read about them.. dont now anything about size or... anything.. ha ha

I ranked them on the "best prey for captive ball pythons".

ASF's are higher than mice due to size.

Gerbils are okay because they are related to the gerboa which is a common prey item in Africa for ball pythons. Very similar. They rank less than mice due to availability of mice vs gerbils usually.

Careful picking up gerbils by their tails. They will drop them at times to get away.

[AlexCrazy]

Holycow... i did not expect that o.o ill do mice.. haha that is so weird.. jajaja thanks everyone for the imput.. im still a bit nervous.. but.. ill get over it once hes here..

[sophiedufort]

Holycow... i did not expect that o.o ill do mice.. haha that is so weird.. jajaja thanks everyone for the imput.. im still a bit nervous.. but.. ill get over it once hes here..

I didn't read all previous replies, but a quick skimming of the page told me that you're worried about feeding your snake. Nothing to worry about, really. A healthy snake will not be finicky. A couple of my snakes are so diligent when it comes to meals, they would probably eat a marble if one was offered to them.

I feed mice to my BPs, and they are doing beautifully. My largest snakes eat rats. I got gerbils the other day, free off Craigslist, and thought about breeding them, but they are very aggressive and I fear for my snakes, so I will revert to mice/rats. By the way, whoever is rushing to give me a lecture on my decision to feed live prey to my snakes, please know that my husband and I are very careful. We stand by, and will reach down in the feeding tub to remove the crazy mouse/rat/gerbil as soon as we see the slightest sign of aggression, even if there is a risk that the snake will strike us by accident. Once I get rid of all gerbils (I still have five) will never get any again.

You can always check Craigslist for local feeder sellers in your area. I just found one, very cheap, not far from where I live.

[Aaron_S]

I didn't read all previous replies, but a quick skimming of the page told me that you're worried about feeding your snake. Nothing to worry about, really. A healthy snake will not be finicky. A couple of my snakes are so diligent when it comes to meals, they would probably eat a marble if one was offered to them.

I feed mice to my BPs, and they are doing beautifully. My largest snakes eat rats. I got gerbils the other day, free off Craigslist, and thought about breeding them, but they are very aggressive and I fear for my snakes, so I will revert to mice/rats. By the way, whoever is rushing to give me a lecture on my decision to feed live prey to my snakes, please know that my husband and I are very careful. We stand by, and will reach down in the feeding tub to remove the crazy mouse/rat/gerbil as soon as we see the slightest sign of aggression, even if there is a risk that the snake will strike us by accident. Once I get rid of all gerbils (I still have five) will never get any again.

You can always check Craigslist for local feeder sellers in your area. I just found one, very cheap, not far from where I live.

I don't know why you or anyone who feeds live prey give themselves so much credit.

Snakes are lightning quick. Anyone who's fed a snake knows this. If a snake grabs even a docile prey item in the wrong spot (does happen) and the animal being constricted gets a tooth in the eye of the snake how fast does any human have to be to intervene between the snake strike and the prey biting the snake in defense in a coil?

Answer is it's impossible. Damage would be done before anything could happen.

[Mikoh4792]

Nothing to worry about, really. A healthy snake will not be finicky..

That really depends on the type of snake, and the individual snake itself. Health is not always a factor. With carpet pythons, it is a common problem for keepers to own what are called "mousers". Extremely finicky snakes that only eat mice and refuse other types of food. I'm sure owners of other types of snakes can attest to this.

[prairiepanda]

I got gerbils the other day, free off Craigslist, and thought about breeding them, but they are very aggressive and I fear for my snakes, so I will revert to mice/rats. By the way, whoever is rushing to give me a lecture on my decision to feed live prey to my snakes, please know that my husband and I are very careful. We stand by, and will reach down in the feeding tub to remove the crazy mouse/rat/gerbil as soon as we see the slightest sign of aggression, even if there is a risk that the snake will strike us by accident. Once I get rid of all gerbils (I still have five) will never get any again.


Aggressive gerbils? I wonder if they were abused by their previous owner? Gerbils are usually quite docile, though some are flighty. Juvies tend to go through a nippy stage, but they only nip softly and never bite to draw blood the way mice and hamsters do. The only time I've ever seen aggression in gerbils is towards other rodents(they are extremely territorial against other rodent species and will try to kill any mice or rats that they encounter). Sounds like your source may have mistreated them.

I would definitely choose to feed gerbils before hamsters. African Soft Furs are great but pretty hard to find. If you can find ASFs, though, you should definitely get those because they get to a perfect size for ball pythons to eat and are naturally encountered prey. I've heard they bite, though, so be careful.

[sophiedufort]

Aggressive gerbils? I wonder if they were abused by their previous owner? Gerbils are usually quite docile, though some are flighty. Juvies tend to go through a nippy stage, but they only nip softly and never bite to draw blood the way mice and hamsters do. The only time I've ever seen aggression in gerbils is towards other rodents(they are extremely territorial against other rodent species and will try to kill any mice or rats that they encounter). Sounds like your source may have mistreated them.

I would definitely choose to feed gerbils before hamsters. African Soft Furs are great but pretty hard to find. If you can find ASFs, though, you should definitely get those because they get to a perfect size for ball pythons to eat and are naturally encountered prey. I've heard they bite, though, so be careful.

They were probably abused. I was horrified by the conditions they lived in. Besides, the owners had a little girl who seemed to have behavioral issues. During the few minutes I spent at their house, the girl abused the poor rodents constantly, while talking like a manic person and trying to show me her love for the poor things.

[AlexCrazy]

O.o little girls tend to not know that squeeze some thing is bad.. or was she really crazy?!
Im so lost actually.. because.. there different awsers everywhere and from everyone.. i dicided ill do mice and then go thru the challenge of changing his taste to rats..

[sophiedufort]

O.o little girls tend to not know that squeeze some thing is bad.. or was she really crazy?!
Im so lost actually.. because.. there different awsers everywhere and from everyone.. i dicided ill do mice and then go thru the challenge of changing his taste to rats..

She was really crazy. I was shocked.

As for feeding, don't worry too much. Mice are just fine. When your snake grows up, you can switch to rats, which are said to have better nutritional values, but I've never seen a snake dying due to eating mice and not rats, gerbils, hamsters or other fancy rodents.

[AlexCrazy]

Ok... thanks.. hes coming on friday! *_*(to the border of argentina then i wil go on a trip in buss to fetch him, 6 hours there and back ha ha) in was sopoussed to be today.. :( but it rained in argentina so my contact could not make the deposit.. only yesterday..

[RAD House]

You could feed any food source listed. As ball pythons tend to be picky eaters I would find the type that you could most easily attain and stick with that. In my opinion buying feeders is way more manageable then raising them, especially for one snake. Frozen thawed mice/rats are nice because you always have the food on hand. Also you don't have to feed or care for a mouse ice cube.

[AlexCrazy]

You could feed any food source listed. As ball pythons tend to be picky eaters I would find the type that you could most easily attain and stick with that. In my opinion buying feeders is way more manageable then raising them, especially for one snake. Frozen thawed mice/rats are nice because you always have the food on hand. Also you don't have to feed or care for a mouse ice cube.
I agree.. but people dont sell frozen mice here.. almost don't sell the live ones.. so ill breed and freeze at the right size... :) so i dont get over populated... you just have to manege them so you dont get over populated... :) calculate your rations.. with the age need and when you will need it :)

[AlexCrazy]

His getting here tomorrow after lunch.. should it be a red flag that she waited to send it to tell me its a 1 year old? In the pic its a baby.. o.o

[Mikoh4792]

His getting here tomorrow after lunch.. should it be a red flag that she waited to send it to tell me its a 1 year old? In the pic its a baby.. o.o

Yes and no. I would say it's the buyer's responsibility to find out or ask for these details before making the purchase, and the seller's responsibility to provide recent photos of an animal before selling it.

[AlexCrazy]

Yes.. youre right.. sorry.. i just thouhgt that the photo was it... it said.. photo of the animal.. so..
I really dont mind him being 1 year old.. it worrys me less.. about the shiping and geting him started and stuf. Or is it a bad thing?

[Mikoh4792]

Yes.. youre right.. sorry.. i just thouhgt that the photo was it... it said.. photo of the animal.. so..
I really dont mind him being 1 year old.. it worrys me less.. about the shiping and geting him started and stuf. Or is it a bad thing?

I would ask the seller why she chose to tell you until after the purchase, or why she did not include its age in the advertisement. But you're right, if it's a year old then chances are it's an established animal(if taken care of right).

[ManSlaughter33]

if it helps,
He will still be very small. my young male when hes curled up, he fits in my hand :)
partially why I call him Donut

[AlexCrazy]

Ohhhh! yes! that really helped.. i thought it would at least be 3Ft or something.. how long is he wen he is not in a ball?
By the way.. SO PRETTY! i just love that morph!

[ManSlaughter33]

He is probably around 2 and half? last time I went to measure him he pooped so I didnt get a chance LOL

[AlexCrazy]

hahah LOL! ok.. im so nervous! ha ha ha the worst part is that my dad knows how i am.. he is gonna go and fetch it.. but will only be back at night.. so he is gonna make me go mad with photos! ha ha ha

[ManSlaughter33]

Don't be nervous :)

[AlexCrazy]

its more exited than nervous.. sorry.. haha that joke on the art threat made me feel more ok! ;) ha ha ha

[Albert Clark]

Good luck with him.

[AlexCrazy]

What size should his food be.. so i can ask in petshops? I wont be there for the buy.. so i have to explain it to my dad or to the petshop..

[ManSlaughter33]

mine takes smaller adult rats But my supplier knows exactly what size.

[AlexCrazy]

Would a normal hamster or mice do?

[ManSlaughter33]

i wouldnt feed mine hamsters.. and I stick with rats.. that's just me

[AlexCrazy]

my dad said.. its hamsters. so.. cant argue with the head of the house. im going to breed hamsters.. my goodness what a merygoround iv taken you all by.. thanks so much for all the so-port..

[AlexCrazy]

OMG! this is a photo that my dad took! i almost cry-id im so happy! he is gorgeous!
i have a question.. he is a normal ball.. (that was what the page said and the woman) but in the photo he was this colorful shine.. does that mean he is some kind of hybrid!? or is that colorful shine normal in BPs?
on a phone you can see the colorful shine better

[DDW]

Congrats! Almost looks like a pastel to me but I'm not very good at remembering the BP morphs. The shine could be from just getting out of shed.

[AlexCrazy]

the owner said he shed 3 weeks ago o.O but its a colorfull like rainbow like shine.. if im not mistaken.. like hybrid do o.O and i never saw a BP photo with that shine in it

[DDW]

I don't know, but I leave that to the more experienced members. Did the previous owner happen to tell you why they got rid of him?

[reptiledude987]

the iridescence is normal but more common in wild caught or specimens kept under uv light. Its not a pastel just a normal but a very nice one.

[AlexCrazy]

the iridescence is normal but more common in wild caught or specimens kept under UV light. Its not a pastel just a normal but a very nice one.
Ohhh..thanks!
DDW.. she did not get rid of it.. i bought it :) from a neighboring country :)

[DDW]

Ohhh..thanks!
DDW.. she did not get rid of it.. i bought it :) from a neighboring country :)

Did you say that before? Breeder? If not a breeder, like reptiledude987 said, might be wc. Nice looking anyway:)

[AlexCrazy]

Did you say that before? Breeder? If not a breeder, like reptiledude987 said, might be wc. Nice looking anyway:)
They breed there snakes... they must of used the UV lighting ore something.. ha ha plus.. there no wild ones around here.. and less over there in Argentina..

[AlexCrazy]

Finally we are together! Touching a BP for the first time was the best thing ever! Thanks so much everyone for the soport! Dream finally came true...

[DDW]

They breed there snakes... they must of used the UV lighting ore something.. ha ha plus.. there no wild ones around here.. and less over there in Argentina..

Okay^.=.^ awesome :)

[DDW]

I'm so glad you finally have your bp, they are awesome snakes:)

[AlexCrazy]

Yeah... thanks.. im so relived.. :D

[EL Ziggy]

Congrats Alex! Best wishes with your new BP!

[AlexCrazy]

His first feed! Soo happy.. i feed him live cos the breeder did. His name is Hercules :D

[AlexCrazy]

Are BPs soposed to be be very shy wen you first get them? Hecules hides each time he sees me... now im spying on him.. ha ha cos my hamster cage cover me.
will he get less shy as i start handeling him?

[DDW]

Are BPs soposed to be be very shy wen you first get them? Hecules hides each time he sees me... now im spying on him.. ha ha cos my hamster cage cover me.
will he get less shy as i start handeling him?

He is probably still unsure of you and unsure of his surroundings. If you give him time to relax, I'm sure he will:)

[AlexCrazy]

So should i handle him? Or must i wait for him stop hiding! :(

[DDW]

So should i handle him? Or must i wait for him stop hiding! :(

I'd wait until he has taken a couple consistent meals for you. That should be a couple weeks or even three if you aren't sure.

[Rattlehead]

Can you post a pic of your enclosure? Maybe you need to put some more hides around.

[DDW]

Can you post a pic of your enclosure? Maybe you need to put some more hides around.

^^^^
Yes this too:)

[DDW]

Remember he is part of a nocturnal species. Is normal for them to hide or sleep during the day.

[AlexCrazy]

Here is his temporary look... i want to go almost 100% natural... his heat pad is under the hide. Wih the green arrow.. were he spends most of his time... at night he explores... loves his water dish (pokes his head in it or goes over it) but wen he sees me at night he goes in to the hide closes to him.. and this friday it will be a week.. i would like to handle him that day.. already waited a week! Haha so hard...

[DDW]

Here is his temporary look... i want to go almost 100% natural... his heat pad is under the hide. Wih the green arrow.. were he spends most of his time... at night he explores... loves his water dish (pokes his head in it or goes over it) but wen he sees me at night he goes in to the hide closes to him.. and this friday it will be a week.. i would like to handle him that day.. already waited a week! Haha so hard...

Sound like he acts very much like the way glitch is other than hiding when I'm seen. (She is curious and just continues looking around) he may just be timid.

[AlexCrazy]

I hope he gets more trust as i start interacting with him... :) i love Glitch by the way... so pretty!

[DDW]

I hope he gets more trust as i start interacting with him... :) i love Glitch by the way... so pretty!

I think he will, and thankyou:) your little guy is handsome too^.=.^

[ManSlaughter33]

I wouldnt handle him for at least a week. let him get used to a new home and new surroundings. after the first week you can handle him for short periods of time.

[ManSlaughter33]

Good luck and enjoy your new baby. .My girl is a normal and shes shiny and a little more orange than my friends normal