Ball python basking under heat lamp but ignoring hot hide..

[kiiarah]

I have only noticed this once, but it was enough to make me concerned. After feeding the other day, Shesha spent about five hours coiled in the top of the climbing branch under the heat lamp. Normally he goes into his cool hide and stays there for the next couple of days (in fact he hasn't used his hot hide that I have seen since discovering the cool one). I am running a thermostat so the temp in the hot hide remains at 90 and the bedding layer is thinned out so he should definitely be able to tell it is warmer there, but for some reason he just isn't interested. I had asked about this a while back and everyone basically said to trust him and that if he feels that he needs the heat he will use it. The prolonged basking under the lamp the other day makes me think he needs heat, but isn't basking under top heat unhealthy? I don't want it to dry him out or anything, and it seems that he still isn't getting the belly heat he needs that way. The ambient temps are never lower than 78 so he shouldn't be cold.

I had tried switching the hides before. Both are half logs but one is smaller than the other. Oddly enough, he seems to prefer the larger one over the tighter fitting one. I figured maybe he just didn't like the hide on the hot side, but even after putting his preferred hide on that side he still went to the cold side. The only other thing I can think is just that for some reason he likes the corner the cool hide is in. Would it possibly be a good idea to flip the tank around so that the heat mat is under the side he prefers and the inside of the tank still looks the same to him? I am confident that he would remain on that side with or without the heat mat under it, but I wouldn't want to "force" him into using the heat mat all the time. I guess basically what I am asking is would it be more dangerous to leave it as is and risk him not getting the belly heat or would it be worse to risk him being on the heat mat 24-7 by changing the side. He spends all his time in that one hide so if the heat mat were under it he would be on it constantly. I wasn't concerned before, but since he is showing signs of trying to thermoregulate to get that heat it seems like I may need to intervene somehow.

[Aaron_S]

I've told you before to not worry so much and fret over every little thing. So quit it.

Is he eating? Is he pooping? Any actual signs of stress/illness? If the answer to those questions are "Yes" "yes" and "no". Quit worrying.

[kiiarah]

Well he is eating, but hadn't pooped since his last shed, which was about 5 weeks ago. I know it can be normal for them to hold it until they shed but since he hasn't shed again it's hard to tell is he's digesting properly. Is there any other way to know that he is? He has no hard lumps towards his tail, but with such long gaps between bowel movements how can I be sure all is well?

I am not really worried per se, just want to be sure this wouldn't be considered a sign of any kind of husbandry issue.

[CrotalusR#1]

If your worried about him possibly being compacted you can soak him in Luke warm water for 30 min or so..just put him in there and leave him alone..if he hasn't pooped by then make him swim a little bit and that
May make him poop. That's a common trick with gaboons.
Nathan.

[Aaron_S]

It isn't. As I said quit worrying that each small change is a sign of something wrong. Take a deep breathe. You're doing fine.

I don't normally keep track of any of my snakes bowel movements any longer. They poop when they poop. I just keep an eye on their overall health and ensure there's nothing abnormal about them.

Some poop more often than others.

[kiiarah]

Yeah the pooping thing hasn't seemed to be cause for alarm. One reason I posted is that my first inclination had been to swap heat mat side, basically tricking him into using it, but I just felt like that would likely be a worse approach. Just seemed like trying to force him to do anything would be dangerous territory. I guess I just needed confirmation of that. I will leave him alone and just keep an eye on him.

If he were keeping himself too cold to digest what symptoms would I see? I am sensitive about the digestion issue because I had a green snake die during hibernation when I was younger and I am pretty sure it was because he was fed too close to going into hibernation and the food rotted. So I am a bit paranoid about the chance of food rotting and killing them. Can I trust that he would regurgitate it if temps were not correct?

[Aaron_S]

Yeah the pooping thing hasn't seemed to be cause for alarm. One reason I posted is that my first inclination had been to swap heat mat side, basically tricking him into using it, but I just felt like that would likely be a worse approach. Just seemed like trying to force him to do anything would be dangerous territory. I guess I just needed confirmation of that. I will leave him alone and just keep an eye on him.

If he were keeping himself too cold to digest what symptoms would I see? I am sensitive about the digestion issue because I had a green snake die during hibernation when I was younger and I am pretty sure it was because he was fed too close to going into hibernation and the food rotted. So I am a bit paranoid about the chance of food rotting and killing them. Can I trust that he would regurgitate it if temps were not correct?

Again. Deep breath and count to 10.

You need to get over the idea that the snake is a helpless baby that can't do anything for itself. These animals come out of the egg already know what prey is, knowing how to hunt AND kill it. If the snake isn't able to digest or eat properly they will do what's best for them. Including regurge.

As for your green snake it probably died due to something else. Food doesn't normally rot in a snake and kill it. If the snake is healthy they will eject it from their body. Much like we do if we ingest poisoned food.

You should never have to trick a healthy snake into anything. If your husbandry is correct then the snake will use the environment to suit it's needs.

Deep breath. I'm serious. Take some.

[kiiarah]

Ok breathing and counting. I guess it had never really occurred to me that something else could have been going on with the green snake. I was about 16 when I had her and for the last 10 years I have been terrified of hibernation times for any animal. I have always viewed them as really fragile and one mistake = death. I guess this may be closer to true for most species but it seems like bps tend to be hardier. I will try to take some comfort in the fact that I have done tons of research and am sure that his husbandry is spot on. I guess really when it comes down to it that is all I can really do, ensure that he has everything he needs. Using it is up to him. Thank you Aaron, I can tell you have been doing this for a while. I can't wait until I have your level of confidence and security about it. :)

[Aaron_S]

Ok breathing and counting. I guess it had never really occurred to me that something else could have been going on with the green snake. I was about 16 when I had her and for the last 10 years I have been terrified of hibernation times for any animal. I have always viewed them as really fragile and one mistake = death. I guess this may be closer to true for most species but it seems like bps tend to be hardier. I will try to take some comfort in the fact that I have done tons of research and am sure that his husbandry is spot on. I guess really when it comes down to it that is all I can really do, ensure that he has everything he needs. Using it is up to him. Thank you Aaron, I can tell you have been doing this for a while. I can't wait until I have your level of confidence and security about it. :)

Thanks for the compliment. I have been at this a really long time. Too long maybe.

Snakes don't actually hibernate. They brumate. The difference being that they are still active and while the metabolism usually slows down they still drink and eat. So a food item rotting isn't likely to happen.

[kiiarah]

No problem :) I recognize experience, it is one reason I am so grateful to have found this site. I can trust that if there is a problem someone will alert me to it and that if there isn't someone will be there to give me a much needed reality check, lol. It is also one reason I post just about any question I can think of that depends on the circumstantial details and cannot be answered by a google search, at least that way if it is a stupid concern I will find out, and worst case if it is a problem I will be alerted to that too. I would much bring up the small concerns and find out I am worrying about nothing than write off something that seems small but that a more experienced keeper may recognize as an early sign of something more serious.

Is it true for all snakes that they don't hibernate. I want to say I read something that mentioned specifically that ball pythons (and all equatorial snakes) do not hibernate because of the environmental conditions of their natural habitat. I thought though that some snakes that live in very cold regions do go through true hibernation. That may have been an assumption on my part though.

[Aaron_S]

No problem :) I recognize experience, it is one reason I am so grateful to have found this site. I can trust that if there is a problem someone will alert me to it and that if there isn't someone will be there to give me a much needed reality check, lol. It is also one reason I post just about any question I can think of that depends on the circumstantial details and cannot be answered by a google search, at least that way if it is a stupid concern I will find out, and worst case if it is a problem I will be alerted to that too. I would much bring up the small concerns and find out I am worrying about nothing than write off something that seems small but that a more experienced keeper may recognize as an early sign of something more serious.

Is it true for all snakes that they don't hibernate. I want to say I read something that mentioned specifically that ball pythons (and all equatorial snakes) do not hibernate because of the environmental conditions of their natural habitat. I thought though that some snakes that live in very cold regions do go through true hibernation. That may have been an assumption on my part though.

No snake that I know of actually hibernates. Garter snakes are one of the best examples.

They head up to what's called a hibernaculum. Hundreds, if not thousands, gather here to hole up for the winter months. If need be they will hunt and go for a drink.

Wayne posted a picture of a snake on snow a year or so ago. So they are out there sometimes.

[kiiarah]

That's amazing, they really are incredibly well adapted aren't they?

I was hoping you could clear one thing up for me. Since I am using the heat lamp and he is now interested in sitting up in the branch is there anything I should know to guard against burns? I know a heat lamp should never be in a tank where the snake can directly contact it, but is it possible for a 50-60 watt to get the screen lid hot enough to be dangerous? Any precautions I should take and how close to the lamp should I allow him to get?

I have to keep the lamp pretty close to the lid to keep his ambient heat at 80 degrees ( it is probably an inch above the screen right now) and the branch he likes goes to about 3.5 inches below the lid, so he can get quite close to it. I could probably readjust things to lower the branch if I need to. The highest point right now is the only place he can comfortably coil up so naturally he goes straight to the top every time. I will leave it where it is as long as there is no real risk of burns or dehydration but he did feel very warm and dry (hard to explain but almost papery) when I came home tonight.

[Aaron_S]

I wouldn't worry about dehydration. Snakes are built to withhold humidity so he should be fine as long as you provide a water bowl, proper humidity and a good diet. I honestly never see my snakes drink.

I think the space right now is fine. I wouldn't worry about a burn from the lid. A burn from that would probably take prolonged exposure to the metal. Just make sure he can press himself against it.

[kiiarah]

Yeah he can get high enough to touch the lid with his head or nose, but there is nowhere he could just lie against it, so that should be fine. I was just surprised because he felt so different and was so warm. I had first assumed he was dehydrated since his skin felt so dry. Do you suppose it could have just been that he felt different because he was warmer than usual? The way he felt is hard to describe, but it was definitely not the normal slick tight skin I am used to feeling on him. It was almost as though his skin was baggy, just more folds than usual almost like a balloon that has started to lose air. He just felt like there was no muscle tone to him. He did perk right up though when I took him out so I don't think he was actually weak, probably just more relaxed than usual.

[CosmicOwl]

I wouldn't worry about dehydration. Snakes are built to withhold humidity so he should be fine as long as you provide a water bowl, proper humidity and a good diet. I honestly never see my snakes drink.

I think the space right now is fine. I wouldn't worry about a burn from the lid. A burn from that would probably take prolonged exposure to the metal. Just make sure he can press himself against it.

I never see my snakes drink from their bowls, but they wll drink water that is sprayed on their heads. I guess they won't pass up water if it's literally right on their face.

[Cmwells90]

I see my Hoggie drink every morning, he does it at first light. I was probably more excited then I should have been the first time. But he's also more active during the day, my Boa usually drinks throughout the night.

[kiiarah]

I do occasionally see Shesha drink from his water dish. My understanding is that constantly drinking could be a sign of low humidity so I don't worry if I don't see him use it regularly. When he first came home I would hold him over the dish and he would drink while I held him, but he seems less interested these days. It was the cutest thing though, he would take a long drink and as soon as he was done he would look right up at me and flick his tongue. I still occasionally offer it to him when I return him to his tank, if he wants a drink he will just reach down and dip his nose in but most of the time he just ignores it now. I have to admit though it was fun "hand watering" him, I know I am anthropomorphising here but it always looked like he would look up at me as a way of saying "thanks mom that's enough for now". He may not have the capacity for that kind of communication but it is fun to think about lol.

[Aaron_S]

Yeah he can get high enough to touch the lid with his head or nose, but there is nowhere he could just lie against it, so that should be fine. I was just surprised because he felt so different and was so warm. I had first assumed he was dehydrated since his skin felt so dry. Do you suppose it could have just been that he felt different because he was warmer than usual? The way he felt is hard to describe, but it was definitely not the normal slick tight skin I am used to feeling on him. It was almost as though his skin was baggy, just more folds than usual almost like a balloon that has started to lose air. He just felt like there was no muscle tone to him. He did perk right up though when I took him out so I don't think he was actually weak, probably just more relaxed than usual.

No big deal. I think you're good.