holding EDBs.

[demonseed]

This is my girl . Matilda. I do have great insurance to the smart elecs who will ask. It's also my snake ,in my home ,and I can handle any one I want. To those that want to try this. Be careful and know your snake

[54bogger]

OH NOOOOO!!!! Not another person free handling a venomous snake!
Don't you know that's bad for our hobby? Don't you know you could get someone killed with that reckless behavior? Don't you know I love that pic!

Very beautiful diamondback.

[Cmwells90]

I understand the points you're (both of you) trying to make, but in my honest opinion this is childish, if you want to free handle your hot snakes, then feel free. But the same right that gives you the ability to do so, also give us (anyone else) the ability to insert our opinion about how we feel about the situation. Clearly you two are friends, and clearly this post is about the other post which wasn't intended to spark a free handling debate, but this post is clearly here to stir up problems, which is what children do. As adults we handle problems in a mature fashion, but I'm sure no one wants to sit here and argue about what is and isn't good for you, individually, we just care about the hobby and want to preserve it as much as we can, which I think is the reason people offered a negative opinion to your free handling in the first place.

But on a lesser note, that is a beautiful snake.

[Derek1]

That is awesome!

[demonseed]

Thanks guys. There is an art to this . You have to really know your reptile. Lol . Barry. Sweet pea and Matilda will have to hang out sometime

[demonseed]

I'm pretty sure we gonna get a spanking from Willow now. Lol

[EL Ziggy]

The song, "It's yo thang, do what you wanna do" comes to mind. Beautiful EDB. Stay safe and best wishes fellas. Kids, DO NOT TRY THIS AT HOME!

[Derek1]

How do you tame a EDB enough to be able to do that? Or any Hot for that matter? Not that I will try, but I am fascinated by this.

[BIGT FROM F.B.]

Do your thing, brother! If that's you, then that's you.

[Akuma223]

Its okay as long as you don't advise people to do the same I guess, I'd also end up holding a HOT if I had one in the end; wouldn't be able to help myself but wouldn't tell others to do the same. Stunning snake by the way.

[CosmicOwl]

Not something I would do. But neither is skydiving. I don't have a problem with free handling, but I don't like it when people treat it like there is no risk involved.

[SSSSnakes]

Not something I would do. But neither is skydiving. I don't have a problem with free handling, but I don't like it when people treat it like there is no risk involved.

Would you skydive without a parachute?

[CosmicOwl]

Would you skydive without a parachute?

No. Don't get me wrong, I think free handling is foolish and dangerous, but so are a lot of other activities.

[MDT]

I guess I'm the smart aleck you're referring to. Dude, it's all about how much you're willing to risk. I've seen the other side. Personally, it's not worth the risk. If you've got kids, it's def not worth the risk.

[Mikoh4792]

Don't you know that's bad for our hobby? Don't you know you could get someone killed with that reckless behavior?

Sadly, the answer to both questions is yes.

[kwhitlock]

Not what I would describe as the smartest thing to do, but to each his own. It is your animal you can handle it how you please. However you won't catch me handling any hot in that matter ever. Beautiful snake however.

[Aaron_S]

Its okay as long as you don't advise people to do the same I guess, I'd also end up holding a HOT if I had one in the end; wouldn't be able to help myself but wouldn't tell others to do the same. Stunning snake by the way.

So these guys are saying not to do what they do yet you're going to go ahead and do it.

Simply "not telling others to do the same" doesn't seem to be working.

[Aaron_S]

OH NOOOOO!!!! Not another person free handling a venomous snake!
Don't you know that's bad for our hobby? Don't you know you could get someone killed with that reckless behavior? Don't you know I love that pic!

Very beautiful diamondback.

Actually this behaviour can kill someone other than himself.

Say he gets bit and then dies. The snake is left to go wherever it pleases. If it gets out and gets into a neighbours yard and bites a young child or anyone, then they can die too from something so preventable. Go post these pictures on USARK's social media pages. Go on. Go wave this in front of the people protecting your legal right to own them.

As Matt said, The fricking doctor who treats the bites, it's really not worth the risk.

[54bogger]

Aron-s - What if the rattler gets out? that's your question? It's obvious you don't know the localities of the Eastern Dianomdback rattler, they are native here in South Carolina and six other southeastern states. So if he get's out he will be with all the other EDB's in our wood's.

[Aaron_S]

Aron-s - What if the rattler gets out? that's your question? It's obvious you don't know the localities of the Eastern Dianomdback rattler, they are native here in South Carolina and six other southeastern states. So if he get's out he will be with all the other EDB's in our wood's.

I'm speaking on a general scale of when venomous keepers do this type of behaviour. Trust me. You aren't the first or the only ones. This type of behaviour is encouraging others. It's seen in these threads. Viable proof that no one listens to "don't do it".

P.S. spell my name correctly. It's right there.

[54bogger]

aroN- Thank's for your input.

[Aaron_S]

aroN- Thank's for your input.

I suppose you don't have an intellectual discussion in you when faced with actual thoughts and opinions. Carry on.

Don't forget... 'MURICA!

[54bogger]

You cant have a rational discussion with Judgemental people.

BTW- Dicussion? and your cracking on me for my spelling!lol

[IW17]

In my personal opinion you have the right to treat your life how you wish. It's your risk. But as a hobbyist, you have to understand the position you're putting all of us in. We are the ones held responsible for the mistakes of others in this hobby unfortunately.

For example, it's my right as a gun owner to invite my friends over to play Russian roulette. But when someone gets killed, it's all over the media, and fuel on the fire for opposing forces. Even if those involved understood the risks.

[demonseed]

If you play russian roulette you are an idiot n e way. Most the notes are dry to begin with unless the snake is being rough handled wich will get you bit. But that bullet will give you full blast every time. So do
not compare the two. Snakes are like people in a sense that if they know an idiot is handling them . They get defensive. I would also. So the ones that disagree. Go cry to mama and suck a bottle. For the rest of us. You go guys . As for the narrow minded. The rest of us don't care about your opinions. If ya scared then play with ball pythons. Don't ever go outside your house. Never drive or fly. And please wear gloves to handle your food. You wouldn't wanna put your self at risk on those hidden dangers we face daily now would you

[Zoo Nanny]

I find the most disturbing thing about the picture isn't the fact that you are holding a dangerous animal but that you freely share the picture. Saying do not do this at home does not stop the 12 year old who sees your picture and attempts the same stunt.

[EL Ziggy]

Unfortunately some lessons have to be learned the hard way.

[Aaron_S]

If you play russian roulette you are an idiot n e way. Most the notes are dry to begin with unless the snake is being rough handled wich will get you bit. But that bullet will give you full blast every time. So do
not compare the two. Snakes are like people in a sense that if they know an idiot is handling them . They get defensive. I would also. So the ones that disagree. Go cry to mama and suck a bottle. For the rest of us. You go guys . As for the narrow minded. The rest of us don't care about your opinions. If ya scared then play with ball pythons. Don't ever go outside your house. Never drive or fly. And please wear gloves to handle your food. You wouldn't wanna put your self at risk on those hidden dangers we face daily now would you

I've owned and dealt with venomous before so my opinion isn't random or that I'm too scared.

Anyway your analogy fails. A rattlesnake is like the gun. The bullet will give you full blast every time. A bite from a rattlesnake will give you full blast every time just the same.

Nobody here cares what you do except for how it will affect everyone's hobby and the fact you stand proud to be playing with fire on social media. As I said, go post this to USARK and post the link here.

[Aaron_S]

You cant have a rational discussion with Judgemental people.

BTW- Dicussion? and your cracking on me for my spelling!lol

One is a typo and one is disrespecting someone's name. Difference.

Judgemental? Pot meet kettle. You and your friend have constantly judged everyone who disagrees with you. Do you need specific quotes?

Everyone is asking respect everyone else's hobby by not advocating or posting these types of pictures here where a LOT of novice keepers come to.

And no, saying "I don't recommend this" isn't a disclaimer for you. In your very threads people have said they want or will do what you do. So very much it falls on deaf ears. Someone is going to die because of you.

[Mikoh4792]

If you play russian roulette you are an idiot n e way. Most the notes are dry to begin with unless the snake is being rough handled wich will get you bit. But that bullet will give you full blast every time. So do
not compare the two. Snakes are like people in a sense that if they know an idiot is handling them . They get defensive. I would also. So the ones that disagree. Go cry to mama and suck a bottle. For the rest of us. You go guys . As for the narrow minded. The rest of us don't care about your opinions. If ya scared then play with ball pythons. Don't ever go outside your house. Never drive or fly. And please wear gloves to handle your food. You wouldn't wanna put your self at risk on those hidden dangers we face daily now would you

So someone is narrow-minded because they disagree with you? Everyone is judgmental. You observe a situation, and judge it.

[BIGT FROM F.B.]

Would you skydive without a parachute?

Only once. LOL!!!

[BIGT FROM F.B.]

So someone is narrow-minded because they disagree with you? Everyone is judgmental. You observe a situation, and judge it.

Agree. Glad for the Ignore list option on here. We all have our little "tics" about ourselves. Some comments are just too brutal to put up with.

[MDT]

demon, maybe i'm not reading this correctly...your post stated that most the "notes" are dry to begin with...did you mean bites? (that's how i took it)....if that's the case, then you are factually wrong...best estimates are 15-25% are dry, but def not "most are dry"..the published data correlates with my clinical experience.

rationalize all you want. free handling these guys is gonna be a problem. maybe to today, maybe not next year, but it will come back on you. i managed a large collection of hots in college. two very large, extremely laid back C. atrox in that collection. no matter how chill they were, free handling would never even cross my radar because it's a ridiculous risk. so, you guys knock yourselves out, free handle all you want, take the risk, but don't act so sanctimonious when you find that you are in the minority or when you are called on reckless behavior that could influence a kid and get them hurt or killed. we don't need any more bad press in the reptile community.

gonna go cry to mom now, cheers.

[54bogger]

If you don't like what's being done why read the thread and respond negatively? If you want to see who started the first judgemental post read my thread and you'll see it wasn't me or demon. As for being in the minority yep, as for conforming to the group, NEVER!

[Mikoh4792]

If you don't like what's being done why read the thread and respond negatively?

Because it's worthy of condemnation. If for example I see a thread of someone boasting about beating people up, should I not read the thread and respond negatively?

If you want to see who started the first judgemental post read my thread and you'll see it wasn't me or demon. As for being in the minority yep, as for conforming to the group, NEVER!

That really isn't the point. If you post up reckless behavior, expect to be "judged". If not, then as advised by other members...keep it to yourself and don't post it here. Otherwise you will be judged.

[Aaron_S]

If you don't like what's being done why read the thread and respond negatively? If you want to see who started the first judgemental post read my thread and you'll see it wasn't me or demon. As for being in the minority yep, as for conforming to the group, NEVER!

You can't say we're conforming! That's being judgemental!

[demonseed]

demon, maybe i'm not reading this correctly...your post stated that most the "notes" are dry to begin with...did you mean bites? (that's how i took it)....if that's the case, then you are factually wrong...best estimates are 15-25% are dry, but def not "most are dry"..the published data correlates with my clinical experience.

rationalize all you want. free handling these guys is gonna be a problem. maybe to today, maybe not next year, but it will come back on you. i managed a large collection of hots in college. two very large, extremely laid back C. atrox in that collection. no matter how chill they were, free handling would never even cross my radar because it's a ridiculous risk. so, you guys knock yourselves out, free handle all you want, take the risk, but don't act so sanctimonious when you find that you are in the minority or when you are called on reckless behavior that could influence a kid and get them hurt or killed. we don't need any more bad press in the reptile community.

gonna go cry to mom now, cheers.
I meant bites. Lol

[54bogger]

You can't say we're conforming! That's being judgemental!

At least you spelled it right.

[demonseed]

You can't say we're conforming! That's being judgemental!

Yall are conforming. Because you condemn those of us who practice our freedom in our homes.

[demonseed]

Only once. LOL!!!
I wouldn't. But I do like sky diving.

[millertime89]

Yall are conforming. Because you condemn those of us who practice our freedom in our homes.

No, were condemning you for posting openly and being a bad example. Countless times it has been said we don't care what you do so long as you don't post openly about it.

[demonseed]

Well reptiles are a way of life to me. Not a hobby. And you can call your self a hobbyists. Man ,its one sided fools like you that ruin this country. I do as I please and I can and will post my pictures. If you don't like it. Th En go hang with your yuppie band of hobbiest. I'll stay where I'm at with the professionals

[Aaron_S]

Well reptiles are a way of life to me. Not a hobby. And you can call your self a hobbyists. Man ,its one sided fools like you that ruin this country. I do as I please and I can and will post my pictures. If you don't like it. Th En go hang with your yuppie band of hobbiest. I'll stay where I'm at with the professionals

You aren't a professional. Professional would indicate that you make a living doing it. At best you're an amateur.

Also, as I said, go post this to USARK. If you think we're so bad go on go tell them how you piss on their efforts.

[54bogger]

Really? We don't care what you do just don't let anyone see it? Really? So I guess we're the dirty little secret no one want's to get out.lol

[Zoo Nanny]

What a shame that you are being so stubborn to not see the harm that you are doing by posting the pictures. As everyone has said no one cares what you do but just don't go posting pictures of a dangerous act on social media sites. Along with giving the hobby a bad name can't you see that you are putting children's lives at risk? I thought from your picture that you were older guess I was wrong, only a teenager with too much testosterone would be that heartless and uncaring.
You should do some reading here in the venomous threads to see how real hot keepers care for, treat and respect their animals.

[54bogger]

You aren't a professional. Professional would indicate that you make a living doing it. At best you're an amateur.

Also, as I said, go post this to USARK. If you think we're so bad go on go tell them how you piss on their efforts.

usark usark usark, you sound like a parrot.

[Aaron_S]

usark usark usark, you sound like a parrot.

I suppose you don't have anything to actually constructively say to me. You only parrot the same things over and over. That you're "innocent" and your blatant disregard for safety won't get someone killed.

When you can actually bring fact and discussion you're welcome to converse with me.

I'm done in this thread.

[demonseed]

Sadly, the answer to both questions is yes.

You aren't a professional. Professional would indicate that you make a living doing it. At best you're an amateur. Well I made a little over 80 grand last year selling snakes that I bred. Hmmm. That's making a living off of it. Oh . Also I left out the fact that I have a degree in biology. I think I do know what I'm doing.

Also, as I said, go post this to USARK. If you think we're so bad go on go tell them how you piss on their efforts. last year I made a little over 80 grand selling my teptiles. I own 2 houses. All paid for by selling reptiles. I'm not a renter where in that case it is a problem to have hots. I OWN my homes and property. They were paid for by reptiles. That's making a living their cuz wich does qualify me as a pro.

[Akuma223]

So these guys are saying not to do what they do yet you're going to go ahead and do it.

Simply "not telling others to do the same" doesn't seem to be working.

I never said that, I'm saying I understand it would be difficult at times not to touch a creature if you have the balls for it. I know i'm not capable of caring for HOTS partly for this reason.