Opinions on interbreeding? (milk/king x corns...etc...)

[gargoyle]

Just wondering what everyone thinks of doing this. If anyone has any interesting pics I"d love to see them as well..

:eb:

[J_Riley]

I strongly disagree with the practice, but that's just me...

[Matt]

i agree, i think species should be kept together, there is no sense in interbreeding species

[Weather1]

I also agree with keeping the same species together. Do different species breed together in the wild?

[Simon]

I do agree....I don't like hybrids.......
but of course there are some out there that looks really nice~
but personally....I don't like having hybrids. Rat x Corn is the most that I can accept......anything other than that I don't like doing........

[vanderkm]

Just so there is someone with the opposite opinion represented -- we have creamsicle corns (great plains rat and cornsnake) and jungle corns (cal king and cornsnake) and I don't have a problem with intergrades or hybrids. Species designations are manmade -- an attempt at organizing nature. Captive breeding programs are manmade -- the manipulation of nature. For some people, what is important is to perpetuate what is closest to the natural state. For others it is to create new colors or features through selective breeding or through combinations. People will try to breed what they believe is attractive and I believe it is a personal decision.

It would be nice if genetic background could be documented and confirmed so veryone would know what they are getting, but that is just not realistic. We are left to trust the people we deal with to inform us about the background of the animals we buy, and unless the hobby becomes more regulated than many of us would like, market demand will continue to determine whether hybrids are produced or not.

mary v.

[Swampwalker]

I don't even like color morphs. I think there is enough variety provided by nature, but thats just me.

[J_Riley]

Originally posted by Weather1
Do different species breed together in the wild?

Yes, sometimes, where their ranges overlap. Elaphe Obsoleta Obsoleta, for example, are the **** of rat snakes, it will interbreed with almost any Elaphe it encounters.

[BWSmith]

Elaphe Obsoleta Obsoleta, for example, are the **** of rat snakes

LOL, Amen to that.

Personally, I dont care for inter breeding. But then again, i dont care for morphs either. i am a purist. i like what nature throws at us. A cool patter or color coming in is nice. i have anice striped copperhead that I am breeding. But it is pretty mucha one shot deal, no inbreeding to bring out the trait. Maybe i will find a striped female. But other than nature popping them out, i try to keep it as natural as possible. there are infinate colors and patterns in nature, i figure why try to make my own;)

[snakemann87]

I agree with everyone, the babies may turn out cool, but they will be weakened by the interbreeding of species, and any babies of those will be even weaker.

[josefg]

Same here. I think than there should not be any interbreeding of species

[BWSmith]

ok, let me flip the coin. Theoretically, would there by any advantages to interbreeding? (i.e. tolerant to a greater range of habitat). In captivity it is not too relevant, just food for thought.

[gargoyle]

For the most part I agree with the majority of you, individual "naturally occuring" species should be left alone and remain a pure line. But realistically we (the pet/herp trade) have been degrading this for decades intentionally. It's great that everyone wants to get back to doing this with locality specifics but some of the colours and patterns are still very interesting even to the most dedicated local specific breeders........

check this pic out that I found on Love's web site,

http://www.cornutopia.com/Corn%20Utopia%20on%20the%20Web/Photo%20&%20Image%20Stockpile%20-%20CornUtopia/Hybrids%205%20collage%20-%20CAPTION.jpg

:eb:

[Kathy]

I think interbreeding can be usefull. Look at dogs, if nobody ever bred a timber wolf with a grey wolf, we may not have a golden retriever today (just an example, I dont think it was those two wolf speciese that developed the golden, but you never know)

[Weather1]

advantages to interbreeding? (i.e. tolerant to a greater range of habitat).


Then how about a North American Snake like a Corn breeding with an African snake like a Ball Python. Then the tolerance to a cooler temp may be possible and imagine a solid orange or red Ball python.

[vanderkm]

The most likely advantage of crossbreeding, besides marketability of a new variety, is hybrid vigor. This occurs in animals that result from crosses that are distantly related, such as intergrades or hybrids or even outcrosses of very different lines within the same species- they show improved general vitality, size, growth rate, feed efficiency, resistance to illness, etc. This is well established and these crosses, as long as they are not of such divergent species that the genes are completely incompatable, will actually result in stronger, not weaker offspring.

It is inbreeding - of closely related animals, through many generations, that results in weaker offspring, since it allows recessive genes for defects and weaknesses to be expressed. Of course this inbreeding is often what hybrid breeders do early in the development of a strain, after the initial cross, because they have so few animals to work with.

Where hybrids will result in less fit offspring is when the genes are so different that the offspring are sterile. Many snake species have such divergent types, physiologies and likely genetic material that crosses would not be possible - like colubrids with boids - without using gene splicing methods to introduce bits of genetic material- so wouldn't likely even be possible to get a corn/ball python cross. I think it comes back to personal preferences - breeders will produce what they like.

mary v.

[eyespy]

I have no problem with hybrids as long as they are honestly represented as such, and are animals that are plentiful in nature. Where I don't agree is when it's a snake already suffering habitat loss and the survival in the wild is threatened. It becomes very important to keep the bloodlines as varied as possible within the species then, but not to cross to other species, in order to preserve the species as a whole.

I don't like hybrid boas because their habitat is disappearing so rapidly, for example. Plus there is so much poaching of the wild animals that captive-bred specimens become our hope for the future, and the bloodlines should remain intact.

[BWSmith]

Good debate :D

[Lisa]

I have no problems with crosses, whether they occour naturally or in the herp room. How ever some of the names can be misleading, ie jungle corns, creamsicle corns, etc. If you didn't know better you would just assume it's a colour morph. Also I agree that when crosses are sold the parent species should be named.