View Full Version : Reptile Tub for Blood Python?
Paratoxins
11-29-13, 10:33 PM
So, I'm no novice to reptile keeping, though I'm starting back with them after a long hiatus.
I'm pretty convinced my mother is, however, getting me a juvenile blood python, 2 - 3ft in length. I'm novice to reptile tubs, as all I used to utilize were glass tanks. I've found them to be unbearably clunky, heavy, and hard to keep with due to size, weight, substrate, etc.
I've built a tub for temporary holding until Christmas, but my real question is, would this tub be suitable for long term holding until it's time to buy a large tub and make adjustments?
Wanna say it's a 50 gallon tub. Ambient temp of 80 - 85F. Hot spot of 90F. It's bare for the moment but I intend to place a dark hide on each side and water in the middle. Paper towels or newspaper for substrate, humidity of 70%.
Will this, one, be acceptable temps and humidity for a Blood, and, two, could ut be used for long term until an upgrade in size is needed for a juvie Blood?
I would post pics if it would let me.
alessia55
11-29-13, 11:37 PM
You'll be able to post pics once you have 5 posts on the forum.
Paratoxins
11-29-13, 11:55 PM
You'll be able to post pics once you have 5 posts on the forum.
Ok, thanks.
Paratoxins
11-30-13, 10:02 AM
Any opinions anyone?
LadyWraith
11-30-13, 10:25 AM
I've built a tub for temporary holding until Christmas, but my real question is, would this tub be suitable for long term holding until it's time to buy a large tub and make adjustments?I don't see why not. They do quite fine in tubs... had mine in one for almost a year until I just recently upgraded to a PVC enclosure. I switched really just for aesthetic purpose since there was nothing wrong with the tub setup.
Wanna say it's a 50 gallon tub. Ambient temp of 80 - 85F. Hot spot of 90F. It's bare for the moment but I intend to place a dark hide on each side and water in the middle. Paper towels or newspaper for substrate, humidity of 70%.
Will this, one, be acceptable temps and humidity for a Blood, and, two, could it be used for long term until an upgrade in size is needed for a juvie Blood?
Your temps and humidity sound good... what are the dimensions of the tub? As I'm sure you know already, blood's are very terrestrial and large bodied so length and width is more important than height. If the tub is a tad big currently for a juvie to feel secure, just add some cover space like extra hides.
Paratoxins
11-30-13, 10:33 AM
I don't see why not. They do quite fine in tubs... had mine in one for almost a year until I just recently upgraded to a PVC enclosure. I switched really just for aesthetic purpose since there was nothing wrong with the tub setup.
Your temps and humidity sound good... what are the dimensions of the tub? As I'm sure you know already, blood's are very terrestrial and large bodied so length and width is more important than height. If the tub is a tad big currently for a juvie to feel secure, just add some cover space like extra hides.
Trying to work my way up to 5 posts so I can post pictures, lol! I don't have measuring tape, but I do know it's a little tall for my liking, I know height isn't needed. If I were to guess... I'd say maybe 3ft long, maybe 2ft wide, and 2ft high... but don't take my word for that.
LadyWraith
11-30-13, 10:44 AM
That sounds like a pretty decent size. My sub-adult is in a 4'x2' enclosure so it sounds like your juvie will be able to grow up for some time in what you have. I'd provide lots of cover... my personal preference is 3 or so hides and crumpled newspaper in between. They're definitely pretty shy and it will appreciate the extra hide space.
Paratoxins
11-30-13, 10:45 AM
Well I'm at 5 now and it still won't let me post them :( Oh well.
Paratoxins
11-30-13, 10:49 AM
That sounds like a pretty decent size. My sub-adult is in a 4'x2' enclosure so it sounds like your juvie will be able to grow up for some time in what you have. I'd provide lots of cover... my personal preference is 3 or so hides and crumpled newspaper in between. They're definitely pretty shy and it will appreciate the extra hide space.
Ah, ok then! I bought two smaller tubs and cut holes in them, singed the edges so it can't hurt itself. I'll maybe buy a small log to stick in the open space or something.
I'd bribed my fiance for some information. It's my understanding it's a female, 2 - 3 ft. long, fairly docile in temperament, and is a T+ Albino, hence why I avoided a bright white light. You could see this if it would let me post my pics :(
I'm told she should be arriving some time this upcoming week.
Paratoxins
11-30-13, 11:12 AM
Let's see if this works... and if I can find measuring tape.
http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o27/Neutralized/IMAG1871_1_zpsc455dae3.jpg
http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o27/Neutralized/Screenshot_2013-11-29-22-58-37_zps3bfdd37e.png
B_Aller
11-30-13, 11:23 AM
all that ventilation will allow your precious heat and humidity to rise right out of this tub.
Modern husbandry technique dictates a closed top enclosure with the lights inside. Humidity attaches to heat, heat rises. what you have there is a meat dehydrator...not real nice to the internal organs of the animals living within.
Paratoxins
11-30-13, 11:29 AM
all that ventilation will allow your precious heat and humidity to rise right out of this tub.
Modern husbandry technique dictates a closed top enclosure with the lights inside. Humidity attaches to heat, heat rises. what you have there is a meat dehydrator...not real nice to the internal organs of the animals living within.
Ok then, I know how to remedy that. Drape wet cloth over the ventilation cut out. Used to do it all the time over a screen top and it worked very well. I'm still letting the slight areas between the plastic and heat lamps go, though. I don't want there to be NO ventilation at all, just a little. Needs some oxygen flowing in.
I still need to test the humidity after putting in paper towels, water, and everything, see how it behaves with the heat/humidity ratio. Just too busy at the moment.
LadyWraith
11-30-13, 11:32 AM
Inventive idea on the light setup. Are they both just for heat or is the bluish one UV? From what I have read/understand... UV can damage the eyes of some nocturnal animals and is usually not recommended. Hopefully marvelfreak will chime in... I believe he keeps his bloods in opaque tubs such as this and doesn't use any lighting at all. Just airholes from what I've seen. I'll warn you... the heat lamps as such can dry out the enclosure so you might need to monitor humidity closely for a bit to see if that's the case. A lot of keepers prefer belly heat for that reason. I'd ditch the analog stick-ons... they are notoriously inaccurate. I previously used Accurite indoor/outdoor digital thermometer/hygrometers. I place the actual unit on the cool side to read ambient temps/humidity and the attached probe on the hot side. I now just use a digital hygrometer in the enclosure and a temp gun to monitor vitals.
Paratoxins
11-30-13, 11:40 AM
Inventive idea on the light setup. Are they both just for heat or is the bluish one UV? From what I have read/understand... UV can damage the eyes of some nocturnal animals and is usually not recommended. Hopefully marvelfreak will chime in... I believe he keeps his bloods in opaque tubs such as this and doesn't use any lighting at all. Just airholes from what I've seen. I'll warn you... the heat lamps as such can dry out the enclosure so you might need to monitor humidity closely for a bit to see if that's the case. A lot of keepers prefer belly heat for that reason. I'd ditch the analog stick-ons... they are notoriously inaccurate. I previously used Accurite indoor/outdoor digital thermometer/hygrometers. I place the actual unit on the cool side to read ambient temps/humidity and the attached probe on the hot side. I now just use a digital hygrometer in the enclosure and a temp gun to monitor vitals.
I planned on letting it run for a few days to monitor it. The lights are just for heat. The blue is a flood light and the red is a ZooMed infra red bulb. How does one use belly heat with these tubs? I thought UTHs couldn't be used with plastic.
I'll see if I can't locate a better thermometer/hygrometer, but I do know what I have now is working properly. I say this because, for a while, it was sitting in my car at about 30F, which the thermometer reflected correctly. The hygrometer said 60% after sitting indoprs, which is correct. Kentucky is actually a humid state. I placed them in the tub, switched the lights on, and the thermometer rose up while the hygrometer dropped down as the heat soaked up the humidity.
LadyWraith
11-30-13, 11:57 AM
The problem with the stick-ons is not their initial effectiveness... it is their eventual demise. The higher humidity required for our sub tropical species creates problems with their internal workings. They may work now, but they WILL more than likely fail later. IMO, temp gun monitoring is useful regardless. It will let you know when you do end up with an equipment failure. I'm not sure what mode of belly heat others use, but my preference is Flexwatt heat tape on a thermostat. I'm not sure about the heat mat+tub equation since I've only ever used Flexwatt personally. I tape it to the shelf that my tubs are on.
marvelfreak
11-30-13, 12:12 PM
Hello! B Aller and LadyWraith are right the light are not needed and will dry out the air. Plus to much light can stress them out. I found over the years they do just fine with what light shines in the cage. I use a plastic totes with little air holes drill in the sides for ventilation. For heat i use UTH pads. They work just fine with totes. The UTH pads are safer than using heat lamps with plastic totes. The key is to use a thermostat. Plus with using a UTH you can simply move the water bowl close to the hot side to bump up the humidity if needed.
As for size i use a heat mate that will cover 1/4 to 1/3 of the bottom of the cage.
This is the kind and site i get mine from. Ultratherm Undertank Heater (UTH)- 11"x23" - Reptile Basics Inc (http://www.reptilebasics.com/ultratherm-undertank-heater-uth-11-x23)
Paratoxins
11-30-13, 12:18 PM
The problem with the stick-ons is not their initial effectiveness... it is their eventual demise. The higher humidity required for our sub tropical species creates problems with their internal workings. They may work now, but they WILL more than likely fail later. IMO, temp gun monitoring is useful regardless. It will let you know when you do end up with an equipment failure. I'm not sure what mode of belly heat others use, but my preference is Flexwatt heat tape on a thermostat. I'm not sure about the heat mat+tub equation since I've only ever used Flexwatt personally. I tape it to the shelf that my tubs are on.
Ahh, I've never dealt with heat tape so I know diddly squat about it.
I figured the humidity had something to do with it. I'll use them for now and upgrade soon.
Paratoxins
11-30-13, 12:25 PM
Hello! B Aller and LadyWraith are right the light are not needed and will dry out the air. Plus to much light can stress them out. I found over the years they do just fine with what light shines in the cage. I use a plastic totes with little air holes drill in the sides for ventilation. For heat i use UTH pads. They work just fine with totes. The UTH pads are safer than using heat lamps with plastic totes. The key is to use a thermostat. Plus with using a UTH you can simply move the water bowl close to the hot side to bump up the humidity if needed.
As for size i use a heat mate that will cover 1/4 to 1/3 of the bottom of the cage.
This is the kind and site i get mine from. Ultratherm Undertank Heater (UTH)- 11"x23" - Reptile Basics Inc (http://www.reptilebasics.com/ultratherm-undertank-heater-uth-11-x23)
Ok, thanks!
Now, what's a thermostat? When I think of thermostat I think of the thing on my wall that regulates my house.
LadyWraith
11-30-13, 12:33 PM
Ok, thanks!
Now, what's a thermostat? When I think of thermostat I think of the thing on my wall that regulates my house.
Same principle... you plug your heating device into it and place a probe that tells the thermostat when the spot you're heating reaches the desired temperature. There are different types... one that shuts off when the temp is reached, and ones that keep the temperature consistent without shutting off. Herpstat, Vivarium Electronics, etc. are a few of the brands available. On/off are usually cheaper than the variable ones. Some keepers feel one is better than the other but it's mostly just personal preference. I use on/off with no issues. If you are using belly heat, a thermostat is NOT optional... most unregulated belly heat gets way too hot and can burn your slithery friend.
Paratoxins
11-30-13, 12:57 PM
Same principle... you plug your heating device into it and place a probe that tells the thermostat when the spot you're heating reaches the desired temperature. There are different types... one that shuts off when the temp is reached, and ones that keep the temperature consistent without shutting off. Herpstat, Vivarium Electronics, etc. are a few of the brands available. On/off are usually cheaper than the variable ones. Some keepers feel one is better than the other but it's mostly just personal preference. I use on/off with no issues. If you are using belly heat, a thermostat is NOT optional... most unregulated belly heat gets way too hot and can burn your slithery friend.
I think I kinda get it. I saw the HerpStat someone installed on someone's custom here, so seeing it helped me understand a little. I'll price check, money is a little tight at the moment since I'm making payments and uave high rent. :(
LadyWraith
11-30-13, 01:00 PM
I think I kinda get it. I saw the HerpStat someone installed on someone's custom here, so seeing it helped me understand a little. I'll price check, money is a little tight at the moment since I'm making payments and uave high rent. :(
A cheap one is better than nothing. Hydrofarm fits that bill. You can get them on Amazon for about $30.
SnoopySnake
11-30-13, 01:01 PM
People have given you some great advice.. I don't have much to add, but Hydrofarm makes a nice digital on/off thermostat that is only around $35, I have one and it's been working great for me...I would also have to stress that you should ditch those analog thermometer/hygrometers as a digital one will do you much better.
Paratoxins
11-30-13, 01:08 PM
People have given you some great advice.. I don't have much to add, but Hydrofarm makes a nice digital on/off thermostat that is only around $35, I have one and it's been working great for me...I would also have to stress that you should ditch those analog thermometer/hygrometers as a digital one will do you much better.
$35 ain't bad. I'd intended to run my test with the analogs and then ditching them. I honestly need a week or two to save up, my upcoming paycheck is the 6th but I got rent to pay so... There goes my paycheck, LOL. We've had some hardships, recently, that's to blame for the lack of savings :/
Lankyrob
11-30-13, 01:09 PM
I think I kinda get it. I saw the HerpStat someone installed on someone's custom here, so seeing it helped me understand a little. I'll price check, money is a little tight at the moment since I'm making payments and uave high rent. :(
I guess i will be the naysayer today, if money is too tight to get a thermostat then you cant afford a snake. Apart from anything else what happens if you need a vet visit?
Paratoxins
11-30-13, 01:15 PM
I guess i will be the naysayer today, if money is too tight to get a thermostat then you cant afford a snake. Apart from anything else what happens if you need a vet visit?
Any kind of animal related emergencies that may be unable to be covered by me are covered by my mother. I've faced criticism on this by people who seemed to think that means I lean on her for money, but it's more of we're a family that just helps one another, especially in the animal field. We're all avid animal lovers and would do anything for them.
The money situation, however, will be resolved in two weeks time, as my fiance has found a high paying job that pays weekly and we'll be saving from there. By the time January rolls around we should have roughly 2k+ saved up with combined paychecks. No, I'm not boasting, I'm just trying to show the money ordeal is very short term, we'll be fine by the time I actually get the snake.
By the by, does any one have experiences with Rodentpro.com? I was thinking about ordering bulk rats from them. We do breed mice(and also mealworms, just getting into dubias), but I wanted to feed rats for the higher muscle content as opposed to all the fat content that mice have.
Paratoxins
11-30-13, 01:45 PM
I'm gonna go ahead and order a thermostat. I looked at the Herpstat page but I can't see where I order one... and they had many options, like the Intro, Basic, 1, etc... Would the Basic do? I know it also had links to the setup procedure. Is that both for heat tape and mats? I'm thinking a mat may work if I find something to prop the tub up with so it sits over the mat but not directly on top of. If you all don't think that would work, then how does heat tape work and where would I find it? I have absolutely no experience with heat tape.
LadyWraith
11-30-13, 02:14 PM
I don't have any experience ordering Herpstat so I'm not sure about that. Yes, the thermostat will work for either heat option you choose. I'm not sure about the mats, but my tubs sit directly on the heat tape... doesn't heat anything but air if there is a gap. I buy my heat tape from the same place marvelfreak suggested for a heat mat. Reptile basics. I *think* the mats come ready to go... heat tape requires connectors and insulators... however, if you request it in the comments section of your order, they will put it all together for you so it'll be plug-n-play when you get it.
Paratoxins
11-30-13, 02:22 PM
I don't have any experience ordering Herpstat so I'm not sure about that. Yes, the thermostat will work for either heat option you choose. I'm not sure about the mats, but my tubs sit directly on the heat tape... doesn't heat anything but air if there is a gap. I buy my heat tape from the same place marvelfreak suggested for a heat mat. Reptile basics. I *think* the mats come ready to go... heat tape requires connectors and insulators... however, if you request it in the comments section of your order, they will put it all together for you so it'll be plug-n-play when you get it.
Oh, ok! I know nothing about it so it would be perfect if they set it all up. I think I may go with the Hydrofarm thermostat for right now and upgrading it a few weeks down the road to a Herpstat. I found the prices and the Basic is a little over $100.
marvelfreak
11-30-13, 02:24 PM
That's how I do my mats and never have had a problem. As for RodentPro I been using them for years and have never had a issue.
Paratoxins
11-30-13, 02:25 PM
I started looking at the heat tape section of the sight and got really confused. :( Is it the connection set I need to buy and leave a comment on or the 12" tape roll or something I'm overlooking?
Paratoxins
11-30-13, 02:28 PM
That's how I do my mats and never have had a problem. As for RodentPro I been using them for years and have never had a issue.
With a very small gap underneath so the mat isn't directly touching the plastic tub bottom?
And thanks, that's great to hear! I've yet to be told what size it eats. She asked me what hoppers were, so it leads me to believe it eats that sized mouse or rat... I need to get my fiance to bug her about it.
marvelfreak
11-30-13, 02:53 PM
For the size tote you have the one I linked would work perfect. There heat pads are made just like their heat tape. All you have to do is plug it in and let it heat up.
marvelfreak
11-30-13, 02:58 PM
With a very small gap underneath so the mat isn't directly touching the plastic tub bottom?
And thanks, that's great to hear! I've yet to be told what size it eats. She asked me what hoppers were, so it leads me to believe it eats that sized mouse or rat... I need to get my fiance to bug her about it.
Hoppers are awful even rats ones for a 2 to 3 foot Blood. At two foot it should be taking small and at three medium to large rats. never feed Bloods mice the are just way to small.
LadyWraith
11-30-13, 03:04 PM
I started looking at the heat tape section of the sight and got really confused. :( Is it the connection set I need to buy and leave a comment on or the 12" tape roll or something I'm overlooking?
I can't remember if the comment section on their site is on the actual item or just the checkout section once you go to pay. Either way, you can place that specification on any of the comment areas and they'll take care of it.
And thanks, that's great to hear! I've yet to be told what size it eats. She asked me what hoppers were, so it leads me to believe it eats that sized mouse or rat... I need to get my fiance to bug her about it.
I also use Rodent Pro with no issues. I'd wait til you got the new addition to judge food size before buying a large bulk quantity. I agree with Chuck above. The snake will also progress to larger food items pretty quickly so you may need to mix and match various sizes for a bulk order.
Paratoxins
11-30-13, 07:29 PM
Ok, I ordered the heat mat you linked and a thermostat. I don't prefer feeding snakes mice because they're mostly fat, where as rats are muscle. Plus, mice only get so big. I may mix and match some items for my order, if I'm able to.
LadyWraith
11-30-13, 09:05 PM
Should be able to mix and match. Rodent Pro uses the fill a box method. You can fill it with anything on the site.
Paratoxins
12-03-13, 11:59 PM
Ok, I actually called the guy myself. Got tired of waiting for an answer.
She's on small rats.
My thermostat came in today and, if the tracking order I'm seeing is the right one, the mat should come in tomorrow. Meanwhile the tank is holding up perfectly but I'm going to go ahead and switch out the lights for the mat/thermostat combo and monitor it.
I have a little more time to work with due to some unforeseen circumstances. Apparently that man's store was robbed last night by an employee he thought he trusted(was a manager). Apparently my snake was stolen but has been found and retrieved and is doing fine. Now he just needs to get ahold of some shipping equipment. I'm just happy my snake is ok... I was so alarmed when I was told she was stolen. :(
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