Peruvian / Columbian compatibility

[gunslinger]

I currently own a columbian boa, approx 3.5 - 4 ft in length. I want to purchase a peruvian baby (gorgeous), but i'm afraid that I will need to get him a separate cage. Can anyone tell me if I shouldn't keep these snakes in the same terrarium?

[sSNAKESs.com]

Husbandry wise, i think they should be fine... But i always keep my stuff seperate, and its in your best interest to do the same! :D

[BWSmith]

It is always best to house snake separate. Reduces the stress on them and the feeding stress on you (I dont know if you have ever had to unravel two 6 foot RTBs in a feeding frenzy!). Also, the size difference is a concern. IF snakes are to be kept together, they generally need to be about the same size.

[rethius]

Well, Maybe if they are babies they'll be fine together! but if they are male and female as adults you may want to keep them seperate! I don't think having Peruvian x Colombian hybrid babies would be a good Idea!
-Jeff W

[gunslinger]

why would having peru x colum babies not be a good idea? just curious

[rethius]

Well put it this way! Peruvians are I'd say (others too) the top notch Bcc. they are like the Sony of the snake world, now crossing a pure bred peruvian with a Bci will result in a whole bunch of peruvianX's floating around! some people may say that they are pure others will say it's not! pretty much you'll just piss off EVERYONE who breeds Bcc! hybrids are generally frowned upon by the herping community! but I only offer advise do what you want! (it wont hurt us in Canada!)!
-Jeff W

[Aztec Fred]

You want to keep them separate for a number of reasons:

a) If one of them has parasites or ANY type of disease they will spread it to the other one, then you will have two sick snakes.

b) Often comunally houseing them causes them stress, as the weaker less agressive one is dominated by the stronger one, often going off food.


c) Peruvians need different temp and heat requirement than Colombian boas , so either snakes suffer when housed together.

d)And last but not least.....when they become adults they can BREED together!

Why is this a bad thing?

Peruvians arent that easy to breed are expensive and their habitat is being destroyed at an alarming rate in the wild. Each one that is brought into captivity should be used to breed with another peruvian, not a more common colombian boa.

The end result would be snakes that arent one thing or the other, but a cross or hybrid betwen the two boa constrictors types. And the offspring wouldnt be worth as much as pure peruvians.


Take care,

Fred Albury
AZTEC REPTILES
U.S.A.

[snake_lover]

Hey ..,
if the peruvian is smaller and i mean way smaller then the bigger one ,the bigger onewould lay on the smaller one then the bigger one could squash the other one ,I keep my suri together with mitch my venezuelan bci
they are the same size i'll say if the 2 boas are the same size as each other it's ok ,,

Regards,
Thomas:)

[snakemann87]

I'd definately say no, first off, because BCC's are more picky than BCI's, and also the size difference, even though they are the same, theres always a chance the one could hurt the other.

[snake_lover]

And what do you mean by that man that one could hurt the other??

[rethius]

and what does being picky have to do with anything?

[gunslinger]

hey, just thought i'd let you all know, i have successfully housed the two snakes, and they seem to be doing fine. I want to thank everyone for their suggestions and advice, but i just don't have the extra cash or space right now to get another terrarium setup...

oh well

[BurmBaroness]

Then you shouldn't have bought another snake. The 2 types of boas need different husbandry requirements, and if on eis smaller than the other, the other could lay on it, crushing it to death, this HAS happened before. You should have waited till you could house them separately. It seems that you cared more for what you wanted than you did about these animals.

[gunslinger]

wow, that was kind of hostile. well, i'm sure that you know everything and all, but my snakes are completely fine, have been from the second that i housed them together. no one else that i have spoken with on the subject has said that i have anything to worry about.
just for the record, i don't appreciate being attacked. you don't know anything about me or my snakes or about what i care about, so don't go acting all high and mighty, miss know-it-all.

by the way, mom, i don't recall ever asking for your opinion on my snake housing ethics, so, in the future, how bout you just keep that B.S. to yourself, okay, baronass?

[sSNAKESs.com]

Gun wow, relax man... Her points are valid and she wasnt attacking you, she was just stating the obvious. If you can house them seperate, i would also advise you to do so ASAP, the snakes may look to be thriving but in reality 1 is probably alot more stressed out then they let on.

[gunslinger]

hey, i can appreciate someone's advice, but she was casting aspersions on my character, saying that i didn't care about my snake's well being, just about what i wanted. i didn't care for that at all.

i appologize to you, jeff, for going off. you are right, i need to chill...
i just don't take kindly to people that feel the need to put other people down.

[Ritus_Reptile]

I perceived barronesses reply to be hostile and unessessary. No one has any right to judge someone like that without knowing there true intentions or character. She seemed like she was getting mad about it. That is not the type of hospitality i would expect from someone on this site. It was kinda rude to say he was thinking about himself and not the snake. If he didnt care about his snake he wouldnt have asked in the first place. I may be wrong but this is the way i feel and saw it.

[LdyDrgn]

Advice was given to not house the snakes together with many reasons why. Instead of waiting, saving up more money to buy a seperate enclosure, gunslinger went ahead and bought the snake. To me, the want of a new snake was more important than the snake's well-being. This is the way I saw it.

[Burm_Crazy]

Peruvian Boa $250
Tote for teporary housing $5

People who gets pissed of by hearing the truth about what should have been done: Priceless

Look folks, as was pointed out, the two types of boas require totally different habitats. This in itself should have beent taken into consideration BEFORE the snake was purchased. If you are unable to provide the proper habitat for each snake then you should have waited until you can. There was nothing hostile in what was stated by others, they were pointing out BASIC boa husbandry. With all of the diseases and parasites around, it is not a good idea to house boas together. What if one has IBD? then both snakes will be infected. And to date there is no cure for it, so you have two dead snakes.

It amazes the heck out of me the attitude people take whensomeone points out that they are wrong. After 25 + years in the hobby, I still get that attitude from people who weren't even born when I started. Now I don't claim to and never will claim to know everything about any snake, but I figure I have a few years experience under my belt and would not mind passing some of that experience onto others. But if this is the way people are going to react to it, then I might as well just stop posting advice and suggestion to those and offer it only to those people who really appreciate it.

[Ritus_Reptile]

Again as i said, there is no reason to be rude and hostile to someone. There are better, more mature ways to explain to someone the correct way to care for there animals. This site is known for friendly, educated people not rude, judgemental people.

burm_crazy good idea bringing up the temporary tote. Most people dont even think about useing them.

gunsligger you can get them at home depot or wal mart for a really good price.

[BurmBaroness]

I believe that it was explained maturely to him by more than one person, and the advice was ignored. I was not being rude in my post, I was being HONEST, which it seems that alot of people here have a hard time with. Don't ask for advice or opinions if you don't want an honest answer. I am not a "yes, I agree", or "hey, that's cool" kind of person. I do not know everything, but I have enough common sense to know that housing 2 snakes together is not good, I quarantine all my new snakes, and the only time they are housed together is for breeding, same species.
There are several snakes I'd like to have, but without the room or the proper setup, I know better than to go buy it anyway, and stress the animal out, or bring disease or parasites into my collection. And that's "MS" BaronASS, thank you.

[Burm_Crazy]

I wasn't being rude.

I was just reinforcing what others have said and what this person seemed to have to blew off as bull.

This is why I get frustrated. They ask for advice, then throw it away and do what they want which most of the time is not in the best interest of the snake or lizard in question.

It is frustrating. If they are not going to accept our advice from our own experience, then why bother coming in here at all asking questions that they think they already know the answers to.
They just end up doing exactly what they want and the animal suffers the harm.

Some people have housed some snakes together without diffioculty. My adivce and that of many others is not to. Especially with IBD. This person has no clue if the snake he already ash or the one he just got has IBD. There is no way to tell until after the snake is dead. By that time it can infect and wipe out a whole collection.
Housing two corn snakes from different locales is one thing, but two different species of boa is another. Even some smaller snakes such as Ringnecks and brown snakes can be housed together as they require basically the same habitat. But these two species of boa that he mentioned require different habitats and should not be housed togehter.

But I digress.... This is starting to turn into a rant.

Thats my advice, freely given from my 25+ years of experience. Take it or leave it.

[Ritus_Reptile]

burm_crazy i wasnt refering to you sorry for the mix up man,i guess i wasnt clear with my second post. I posted a second post because I dont think my point was understood. I was just saying to baroness that she could have been nicer about it. Her points are very valid and i thought that the way she went about it was kinda rude. In fact i complimented you for bringing up to tote idea:). You also went about getting your point across without being rude.

I also didnt like the fact that gun said oh well after everyone gave him there advice

[Ed_r]

Funny how I just posted a small novel on this subject. Never house to defferent subspecies together. they have similar, not the same housing requirements. The come from different locals, and possibly have different tolerances. If you cant afford to house them properly you should wait until you could. Here is the link to my post. Words to herp by. be responsible.

http://www.ssnakess.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=12043

Not to mention ALL new additions should be quarentined for at least 90 days before introducing to your collection.

[Grant vg]

Gun,

Never did Ms. Baroness include any exclamation points or capslock in her post. I would have written the same thing in that position. And i read it as straight observation, not character attacks.
You asked for advice and was given plenty of "good" "solid" reasons why not to keep them together.
you then got that snake anyways, and housed two completely different sized/types of boa together, something that is totally against husbandry standards.
So dont expect not to be called on it. and you were called on it in a much nicer manner then most ppl would have responded.

An attitude of "Oh well" makes me think you dont really care for your animals, however, as u stated, we dont know you, but your present attitude is all we have to go on.
So in the future, for the well being of your snakes, take the time to take in ppls advice and make a wise decision.
Its a bitch to have to wait a few more months to get that "oh so wanted snake", but atleast you know u will be housing it properly and giving it the environment that is needed.

gvg

[Jeff_Favelle]

Burm_Crazy and BurmBaroness, why do you think I stopped posting! I fully agree with everything you had to say! Why do you think that none of the big breeders post anymore? Its just not worth it 90% of the time. People want help and when it isn't worded the way they like, wammo! they go nuclear. Not for me. I have too much to do in a day, every day to deal with that. It took me 1980+ posts, but I learned my lesson, LOL!

Thanks for the good reads.

:D



It amazes the heck out of me the attitude people take whensomeone points out that they are wrong. After 25 + years in the hobby, I still get that attitude from people who weren't even born when I started. Now I don't claim to and never will claim to know everything about any snake, but I figure I have a few years experience under my belt and would not mind passing some of that experience onto others. But if this is the way people are going to react to it, then I might as well just stop posting advice and suggestion to those and offer it only to those people who really appreciate it.

[BoidKeeper]

Ha ha, what took you so long Jeff? I've learned from you, and I'm not just talking incubators!
Cheers man,
Trevor

[gunslinger]

okay, first of all, i had already laid a down payment on the snake BEFORE my first post... probably not the best idea i admit. i came here looking for friendly advice, and got it for the most part, until my post the other day, which i feel got a rude and unwarranted response from baroness.
i can very freely admit that i have no where near the knowledge of some people (when it comes to snakes) who post here, which is the reason i came here in the first place. i wish to appologize for my VERY rude response to the baroness... it is immature and stupid to call someone down for their attitude, then give them twice the attitude back... i think burm hit the nail on the head... there was some truth to the baroness' statement, but i think everyone will agree that it could have been stated without casting aspersions on my character, which does nothing but get people pissed.

now, just for the record, i have been saving enogh money to purchase separate housing for my peruvian boa. i should have saved up enough for a decent house for him by the end of the month. it was never my intention to leave them in the same habitat forever, but as i mentioned earlier, by the time i had posted on your site, i had already put down payment on the boa. i'm sure that some of you will view this as irresponsible on my part, and you are probably right, but nobody's perfect, and until you have at least met me, you have absolutely no right to judge me... so back off.

ps, in response to other posts:

Ritus, i appreciate the backup. points could have been made without character attacks.

Grant, an exclamation point wasn't necessary. If i'm the only one who could tell that the baroness was pissed, then maybe i'm crazy, but i don't think so. and, once again for the record, i had already laid down money on the snake when i posted the first time, and my concern for the snake should have been made apparent to all by my desire to post in the first place. upon reading everyone's advice, i began saving money for a separate setup for the peruvian. my post the other day was just to let everyone know that the snakes were doing fine, the small one hadn't been crushed, didn't appear to be stresses, and the oh well was an attempt and reverence and levity, as in "oh well, i guess **** happens"... so please, don't judge me. it's very easy to mistake someone's meaning if all you have to go on are his or her written words (as might be apparent from my reaction to the baroness' post, which could very well have been pure observation, but since i am only reading what she wrote, it's very open to gross misinterpretation), so, in the future, how bout we ask before we judge?

anyways, i want to thank everyone one more time for all their helpful advice. i will be purchasing a tote today with some spare moss and a small water dish, just until i can afford that new house...
let me appologize if i offended anyone, i have a tendency to do that on occasion, especially if my feelings are hurt
now, how bout we squash this beef and get back to the forum's true topic... boa's!!

[BurmBaroness]

I also apologize if you took my post the wrong way. I was in no way pissed off, just thought no one would or should buy a snake without proper housing. My fault for assuming everyone thinks to use a plastic tote as "Temporary" housing. BTW, if I DO get mad, believe me, it will be very apparent....lmao. Although I will still refrain from dursing or calling names.

[asphyxia]

Well now all lets just sit down and have some pie together shall we
LOL


Brian

[gunslinger]

update!!

i have purchased a new terrarium / basking lamp for my baby peruvian. I am going to buy a heating strip (one of those things that sticks to the bottom of the cage?) today, and will have him in there by tonight...

i was wondering... any advice on what temp/humidity i should keep the cage in? i usually use a mister on the moss in the cage to create humidity, is this a good method, or are there better ways to keep the cage humid?

[BurmBaroness]

Is there a screen lid? A lot of my cages have screen lids, for those, I just cover 1/2 to 2/3 of the screen top with a damp towel. Can't help you with the temps, someone will come along and do that, or you could check out a caresheet for the temps. Good Luck!

[gunslinger]

wow, i never thought of the damp towel thing... good idea!!

yeah it's a screen lid...

thanks for the help, baroness

[hip]

Well I am back hey Jeff F (true words you speak so I also took a break)I think you remember the last time I tried to help someone out! o well here goes again.Try this gun should do the trick just right for that roovy you got. Humidity some were between 65-80% (let the actions of your snakes shed cycle help you to make adjustments)Keep notes on this it will help.temps should be mid 80's ambient in the day time with a hot spot of 92-95 or so,keep the hot spot at night but drop the ambient to 80 or so at night.

I would watch the prey size for the first year as roovies can regurge with too large a meal (so will a lot of bcc in the first 1-2 years)I would also invest in a good spray on vitamine supplement with beta carrotine (instead of vitimine a) and apply a couple of squirts to the prey every other feeding or so(this really helps if you are using frozen )I can't stress enough to keep records that way you will know what changes you make have what effect on the boa.Find a good vet and go every 6 months or so for a check up.I hope you have many many happy years with your boa's

The hour of the wolf is upon us

Hip
Beers to Jeff

[gunslinger]

what is a good product to use to measure temp and himidity?

what about providing an area for the reptile to soak? i've heard that some bci like soaking...

[Ed_r]

Whoaaa 92-95 is too hot. 88 on the hot side Max. Radio Shack has a few digital thermomemters and hygrometers. they range anywhere from $7-8 up to like $25.00 for an all in one unit. Thats U.S. too btw.

BCIs and BCC both Love to soak. They don't do it all the time but give them the ability to do so. Normall I dont worry about the humidity for them unless its a real dry winter.50-60% is usually fine, any more constant humidity and you may be asking for skin problems like blistering.

A humidity box is a good idea. I don't use one, really don't seem to need one. Just with a soaking bowl they shed 1 piece no problem. They will probably start to chose to urate and deficate in their water too. Depending on the cage they are in, the damp towel trick works wonders on a screen top cage.

[Jeff_Favelle]

Hip, the Stanley Cup playoffs are coming up, so I may just have to take you up on those beers!!!

[hip]

I stand corrected my temps should have read 85-92 or there abouts on the hot end and mid 80's on the cool end.I wish my B.c.i's and my B.c.c loved to soak when ever I try to put them in the tub with some water in it for a little soak I have nasty snakes on my hands they hate the water and of course they take that hate out on me.Sorry for the temp confusion I will keep my mouth shut on the humidity issue mine like 70% or so and have no problems But my boas are not your boas so there needs are different


Hey jeff what is the Stanley cup? Is it for drinking beers out of?
You are a long way away for a beer run man but you are welcome if you ever come to town.



Hip